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A Road Is A Road To Socialism Road

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In 1976, the City of Cleveland issued NINE building permits. NINE. When we start to feel down about the progress of development here vs. other cities, remember how lifeless Cleveland was and how far it's come.

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Private sector (even partially in this case) don't seem to work well. Yet we continue to demand that the rails be uniquely free enterprise from the dirt they set on to the GPS-based dispatching systems.......

 

Indiana Toll Road operator weighs bankruptcy, sale

September 12, 2014 3:30 pm  •  Joseph S. Pete joseph.pete@nwi.com, (219) 933-3316

 

The Indiana Toll Road operators are looking at filing for bankruptcy to get out from under $6 billion in debt and selling the right to operate the road, according to media reports.

 

Citing anonymous sources, the Wall Street Journal reported the road's operators, Spain's Cintra and Australia's Macquarie Group Ltd., have reached an agreement with their largest creditors to restructure debt in bankruptcy court and to sell a new party the rights to operate the road under the remainder of a $3.8 billion, 75-year lease.

 

The Indiana Toll Road Concession Co. would file for Chapter 11 bankruptcy, which involves the reorganization of debt and not liquidation, sell the right to operate the road, and funnel most of the sales proceeds to secured creditors, which are mostly hedge funds.

 

READ MORE AT:

http://www.nwitimes.com/business/local/indiana-toll-road-operator-weighs-bankruptcy-sale/article_a0ddecd7-ce7a-5449-88a1-2baf0f7e1f76.html


In 1976, the City of Cleveland issued NINE building permits. NINE. When we start to feel down about the progress of development here vs. other cities, remember how lifeless Cleveland was and how far it's come.

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I can certainly see how a privately operated toll road is at a disadvantage when surrounded by highly subsidized "free" roads.  Rail of course has the same problem. 

 

There's two ways to deal with a situation like this.  Add subsidies for the travel modes that have been put at a disadvantage, or remove the subsidies for the mode that's being given an unfair advantage.  Generally we as a country have only done the former, which helps a little bit to level the playing field, but which continues to distort the market for transportation as a whole.  Few seem to be advocating for the latter with any seriousness (it's a total blind spot of cognitive dissonance for the libertarian/tea party types), with the exception of Chuck at Strong Towns http://www.strongtowns.org/journal  There's also a very relevant analysis of the subsidy situation at http://urbankchoze.blogspot.com/2014/09/are-transit-subsidies-justified.html

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And they call mass transit social engineering??

 

"A modern highway system would extend

a city's commuting radius 6 times."

—Norman Bel Geddes, Futurama, 1939

 

B4CUVERIcAEqIR6.jpg:large


In 1976, the City of Cleveland issued NINE building permits. NINE. When we start to feel down about the progress of development here vs. other cities, remember how lifeless Cleveland was and how far it's come.

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And they call mass transit social engineering??

 

"A modern highway system would extend

a city's commuting radius 6 times."

—Norman Bel Geddes, Futurama, 1939

 

B4CUVERIcAEqIR6.jpg:large

 

...and all you have to do is spend 20% of your life trapped behind the wheel of a car!

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Study: Roadways don’t yield sufficient gas tax revenue to cover upkeep costs

By Ashley Halsey III January 28, 2015

 

Understanding the traffic congestion that smothers Washington and most major cities is a simple numbers game: Since 1960, the U.S. population has grown by 135 million and the number of motor vehicles on roads has increased by 179 million, traveling almost 2.2 trillion miles farther.

 

Yet the network of roads to handle those burgeoning numbers grew by just 15 percent during those 55 years. Already lagging behind the demand, and with hundreds of thousands of miles in need of repair, the roads will be asked to absorb a population expected to swell by an additional 100 million in the next 50 years.

 

“Highways are incredibly important, but we have spent decades trying to solve every mobility need with big roads, and it hasn’t worked,” said Kevin DeGood of the Center for American Progress (CAP). “What we need is a system that provides people with real choice.”

 

DeGood co-wrote a report, released Wednesday, that challenges the status quo in transportation thinking and debunks the belief that highways can pay for themselves while public transit cannot.

 

MORE:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/trafficandcommuting/study-roadways-dont-yield-sufficient-gas-tax-revenue-to-cover-upkeep-costs/2015/01/28/c9c0a92e-a585-11e4-a7c2-03d37af98440_story.html


In 1976, the City of Cleveland issued NINE building permits. NINE. When we start to feel down about the progress of development here vs. other cities, remember how lifeless Cleveland was and how far it's come.

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What happens when you privatize a road? Most do poorly financially or even go bankrupt. And it doesn't help when the executives of a bankrupt road company take $25 million bonuses....

 

Bankrupt Toll Road operator's executives to share $2.5M bonus once purchase deal closes

Published March 18, 2015

Associated Press

 

MUNSTER, IND. –  Top executives from the bankrupt operator of the Indiana Toll Road will split $2.45 million in bonuses once an Australian company closes on a $5.72 billion deal to buy the lease-holding business.

 

ITR Concession Co. CEO Fernando Redondo and four other company executives will share the bonus money when IFM Investors completes its purchase of the company, The (Munster) Times reported (http://bit.ly/1FBEs1O ).

 

That deal is expected to close within months. ITR Concession will use the $5.72 billion to pay off its creditors.

 

MORE:

http://www.foxbusiness.com/markets/2015/03/18/bankrupt-toll-road-operator-executives-to-share-25m-bonus-once-purchase-deal/


In 1976, the City of Cleveland issued NINE building permits. NINE. When we start to feel down about the progress of development here vs. other cities, remember how lifeless Cleveland was and how far it's come.

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Asphalt Socialist -- love it!

 

City Observatory ‏@CityObs  17h17 hours ago

When it comes to driving, everyone's a socialist!

 

http://cityobservatory.org/a-helicopter-drop-for-the-asphalt-socialists/


In 1976, the City of Cleveland issued NINE building permits. NINE. When we start to feel down about the progress of development here vs. other cities, remember how lifeless Cleveland was and how far it's come.

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Should failed private-sector roadways be abandoned, torn up and turned into bike paths like failed railroad routes?

 

Aman Batheja ‏@amanbatheja texastribune.org 47m47 minutes ago

Big news: Private Texas toll road SH130 has filed for bankruptcy. Story coming. #txlege


In 1976, the City of Cleveland issued NINE building permits. NINE. When we start to feel down about the progress of development here vs. other cities, remember how lifeless Cleveland was and how far it's come.

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Private railroads pay property tax on their right of way.

The owner of the highways and roads do not pay property tax, but instead pull property tax money out of people who live in the same country, state, county, municipality, (and thin air) to cover expenses.

Amtrak doesn't pay property tax on its stations and amtrak-owned rail, but the majority of routes are run shared over freight track, which is taxed, and I'm assuming that freight lines then factor their costs into whatever they toll Amtrak for crossing through.

 

What happens when cities privatize their toll roads, does the toll operator pay property tax on all of their highway?

 

For a back-of-the-envelope calculation, anyone want to count up how many acres of land ODOT owns for highways, and then also local roads, and then pick a rate to charge them? If highways paid property tax, I'm pretty sure that would keep them out of downtowns. It would probably also encourage just slowing down to make an interchange, as opposed to humongous "cement mixer" / cloverleaf / figure 8 / fly-over-under-in-and-out. Some highway entrances/exits in Los Angeles remind me of this. They were designed prior to "modern" guidelines, and you've got to go 0-60 in the blink of an eye to merge on. (Probably the sole impetus behind Tesla's ludicrous mode).

 

I also wonder if any NIMBY movements we able to galvanize their opposition, claiming hey, put this highway in the edge of that district, so we don't lose out on future property tax revenue.

 

Lastly, what-if, a city had a super road diet, shrank the number of lanes, and then gave the store-fronts more space in front of their property (i.e. room enough for outdoor seating). They could then charge property tax on that land?

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US cities were densely developed by pre-New Deal capitalism until automakers/big oil began a campaign to encourage government-funded sprawl and more car ownership & driving. Shell and GM hired modernist Norman Bel Geddes to plan the postwar city of tomorrow. And read the quote of Studebaker's Paul Hoffman:

http://tinyurl.com/j4hlg9l

 

14317511_973365516119383_832729194131819909_n.jpg?oh=7a5cf1c6eb25619564a7d9781a3e5a5e&oe=58395F89


In 1976, the City of Cleveland issued NINE building permits. NINE. When we start to feel down about the progress of development here vs. other cities, remember how lifeless Cleveland was and how far it's come.

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Highways sliced through cities in the 50s and 60s, demolishing and isolating entire neighborhoods. Here's why: https://t.co/sKHOEdK7r1


In 1976, the City of Cleveland issued NINE building permits. NINE. When we start to feel down about the progress of development here vs. other cities, remember how lifeless Cleveland was and how far it's come.

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Why Americans drive too much from @LitmanVTPI. It's the bottom 2 (or 3 depending on your perspective) that are the problem https://t.co/8q9OcsZqNP


In 1976, the City of Cleveland issued NINE building permits. NINE. When we start to feel down about the progress of development here vs. other cities, remember how lifeless Cleveland was and how far it's come.

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Highways sliced through cities in the 50s and 60s, demolishing and isolating entire neighborhoods. Here's why: https://t.co/sKHOEdK7r1

I have read articles about this topic for years. Another interesting tidbit along this topic is that post WWll with the interstate highway system, and the creation of the suburb it made the USA much less ethnic. Poles, Irish, Italians, Greeks etc all had their own hoods (depending on the city). With the suburbs people clustered around economic/income status, not country of origin or religion.....not nearly as much. My Mom grew up in Northside/Cincy. For the Catholics the Germans went to St. Boniface and the Irish St. Patricks. Seems silly today.

 

Suburban flight was going to happen but it required a perfect storm, ending of WWll, infrastructure going to the burbs, a good economy, affordable autos. It really was not "White Flight". Black Americans move to the burbs as soon as they can, and most do today. Ironically Black Americans are getting pushed out of places like SF, Oakland, DC, NYC, LA. Heck look at OTR. The mass gentrification movement of urban America always has some controversy attached to it, nonetheless virtually anyone can participate in it and sometimes you do not need a lot of money, sometimes you do.

 

Regarding the urban hoods getting demoed for interstates, that happened to all kinds of hoods. If you are going to get married and have kids most couples want to be able to stretch their legs and have a yard, sometimes you can do that in the city but often a nice suburb is the best place. I think what is happening now is that the older suburban ring is looking pretty shaky or dicey. Some of those homes and streets are looking pretty bad. When I was in HS I lived in a burb called Devonshire in NE Indianapolis. It was really nice. Over the past 10 years, when I go back, a lot of the homes there are in bad shape, lawns look like crap. Everyone moved north to Fishers.

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You conveniently left out the fact that during the post war white flight, African Americans could not get FHA loans.

And you forgot to mention red lining in lending.  :roll:

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Highways were meant to connect American cities, but in some glaring cases, they also cut right through them – splitting apart neighborhoods and communities.

https://t.co/sfzuQOcz0J


In 1976, the City of Cleveland issued NINE building permits. NINE. When we start to feel down about the progress of development here vs. other cities, remember how lifeless Cleveland was and how far it's come.

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When cities require off-street parking with all new residential construction, they shift what should be a cost of driving—the cost of parking a car—into the cost of housing. A price drivers should pay at the end of their trips becomes a cost developers must bear at the start of their projects. Faced with these minimum parking requirements, developers may build less housing, and the housing they do build may be more likely to include parking. Parking requirements could therefore reduce both the amount and variety of housing in a city.

 

https://www.accessmagazine.org/spring-2014/parking-requirements-housing-development-regulation-reform-los-angeles/


In 1976, the City of Cleveland issued NINE building permits. NINE. When we start to feel down about the progress of development here vs. other cities, remember how lifeless Cleveland was and how far it's come.

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OK, this is the best metaphor I've ever seen -- why transportation in America is like free ice cream day. Induced demand told through ice cream economics....

 

The Ben & Jerry’s crash course in transportation economics

http://cityobservatory.org/benjerry-2018/


In 1976, the City of Cleveland issued NINE building permits. NINE. When we start to feel down about the progress of development here vs. other cities, remember how lifeless Cleveland was and how far it's come.

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Why highways have to be an exercise in socialism to survive.....

 

TOLL LANE LOSSES: MARKET FAILURE OR MARKET SIGNAL?

Charging tolls will give feedback about whether these roads were an efficient land use to begin with.

https://marketurbanismreport.com/toll-lane-losses/


In 1976, the City of Cleveland issued NINE building permits. NINE. When we start to feel down about the progress of development here vs. other cities, remember how lifeless Cleveland was and how far it's come.

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Oldie but a goodie....

 

Road Funding as a Prisoner's Dilemma

https://www.strongtowns.org/journal/2017/2/6/road-funding-as-a-prisoners-dilemma


In 1976, the City of Cleveland issued NINE building permits. NINE. When we start to feel down about the progress of development here vs. other cities, remember how lifeless Cleveland was and how far it's come.

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Not sure if there is a better place to put this so I'm throwing it in here...

 

Ohio out of money for new road projects, prompting talk of gas tax hike

 

COLUMBUS — 

Within weeks, new Ohio Gov. Mike DeWine and state lawmakers will face a huge challenge that impacts every Ohioan every day: how to come up with hundreds of millions of dollars to pay for road and bridge building and maintenance projects.

 

https://www.daytondailynews.com/news/local/ohio-out-money-for-new-road-projects-prompting-talk-gas-tax-hike/yGZbB7uirxSZIYBJLnf7wO/

 


“To an Ohio resident - wherever he lives - some other part of his state seems unreal.”

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I thought this was a nice place for it.....

 


In 1976, the City of Cleveland issued NINE building permits. NINE. When we start to feel down about the progress of development here vs. other cities, remember how lifeless Cleveland was and how far it's come.

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44 minutes ago, taestell said:

The federal highway trust fund is broke. It's time to either raise gas tax or dramatically cut back on highway expansion.

 

 

1

 

Acknowledging the problem is only the first step.  Unfortunately, neither of your proposed solutions would go far enough.  I'd say that the gas tax needs to be increased signficantly (and pegged to inflation for automatic increases in the furture), there needs to be a federal vehicle registration tax, we need to dramatically cut back on highway expansion, AND we need to put more money into interstate passenger rail and public transit.  

 

The funding shortfall from a almost-never-increased gas tax can't be made up by increasing the gas tax.  The increase would have to be so large to come close that electric vehicles would quickly become very popular. But they still use the road and their use on the road deteriorates the road, so there is a basis for applying a vehicle registration tax -- preferably one based on weight (sorry truckers).  To keep our roads in better state of repair, we really should find ways to ship more goods by rail for longer distances.  That may mean some federal subsidies to private railroads but that is justifiable to balance out the subsidies (underfunded roadways and reduced gas taxes) provided to trucking companies.  And improving the rail lines would also help passenger rail, which would get more cars off the roads.

 

Not to mention the efficiency gains of trains over cars and planes, and the reductions in pollution and greenhouse gas emissions from having fewer cars and trucks on the roads.

 

We already have more lane-miles of roadway and more bridges than we can afford to maintain (and I say that in the face of much grumbling about current taxes), so just cutting back on expansion won't reduce our costs, it will only make future increases slower.  We may need to take steps to reduce the overhead (get rid of excess lanes, narrow lanes, abandon or sell off some rights-of-way).

 

We also should mandate that maintenance costs be included in the decisions about whether to add more lanes/build more roads/bridges.  You can't just build it, cut the ribbon, celebrate, and walk away -- when you invest in infrastructure you have to protect that investment with maintenance (no one enjoys paying for a new roof or cleaning the chimney, but it has to be done to maintain the property).

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Tax by the mile! We already have Echeck facilities that could easily take your mileage once a year. Working downtown and living in a status sub-development Avon or Solon may not look so attractive at that point.

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E Check doesn't exist in most of the state.

 

Also, what about all of the people who drive on Ohio roads, but don't live in Ohio? I'm thinking particularly of people in Kentucky along the river who commute into the state every day. Wouldn't they essentially be driving for free? Right now, at least if they buy gas, they do support the roads.

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Mileage taxes should probably be collected on a national level if possible, to eliminate the cross-state issue while also not having to rely on GPS tracking equipment.  If that's not possible, then from a revenue generation standpoint it's probably a wash.  People who are using the roads but aren't paying for them are mostly balanced out by those who are paying for the roads but driving elsewhere.  Those northern Kentucky residents currently don't pay for Ohio roads if they buy gas in Kentucky but drive over here, and they still have to drive on Kentucky roads to get here in the first place.  Still, my point is that they're just as likely to be balanced out by Ohio residents doing the same thing in Kentucky. 

 

Anyway, what we need is BOTH a gas tax and mileage tax.  The gas tax should be used to pay for the externalities of burning gas, not for funding roads.  Put the money to pollution cleanup, military protectionism, climate change, and the like.  Then you don't need special gas for offroad use and you're not taxing lawnmowers and generators for road building.  That's what the mileage tax is for, which I think should be as simple as a yearly odometer reading and a fee based on vehicle axle weight.  The rate itself shouldn't be based only on weight though.  Cost of roads and highways isn't so much about pavement depth as pavement width.  Yes it costs more to engineer a roadbed to handle an 80,000lb tractor trailer than typical passenger cars, but the cost doesn't scale linearly with the amount of damage.  Also, it's the passenger cars that are demanding ever more lanes and signals and new capacity.  Lightweight economy cars don't solve that problem, no matter their power source.

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How is a mileage tax supposed to be enforced?  Sounds like opening the door for invasive surveillance.

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13 minutes ago, tklg said:

How is a mileage tax supposed to be enforced?  Sounds like opening the door for invasive surveillance.

 

I imagine when you renew your tags you could report your current mileage on your vehicle, and pay taxes based on that. You could also pay taxes on mileage any time you sell your vehicle or transfer your plates to a new one.

EDIT: But this would only be enforceable at the state level. I don't think the federal government could require the state DOT's to record this info, but if they attached funding to this requirement, I'm sure just about every state would do it.

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