Cincinnati Streetcar / Cincinnati Bell Connector News

[OCtoCincy 0]

Mallory: Cincinnati Will Have Streetcars

 

While members of Cincinnati City Council's finance committee are taking their two weeks before their next meeting to think about the proposed $102 million streetcar plan, Mayor Mark Mallory is confident the streetcars will happen here.

 

 

He said at his weekly press briefing Tuesday that he's "always been clear" that the route would go to Uptown once money was raised to pay for it. A city proposal suggests building a loop from downtown through Over-the-Rhine as an initial phase, but a majority of council members last week signed a motion by Roxanne Qualls that says the city shouldn't proceed with construction until it can build the route all the way to Uptown.

 

Part of the confusion among council members, he said, is that they have conflicting definitions of words like "phase" and "plan."

 

 

 

"We're going to do it," the mayor said. "It's going to take resources. It's going to take commitment. But the energy is there."

 

 

 

posted by Jane Prendergast at 2/26/2008 03:49:00 PM  0 comments links to this post

 

 

Just wanted to share...

[jmicha 28]

I wish that man was still in office.

 

It feels good to know that he got us this far though and that in only 7 months we'll be seeing trains testing. It's approaching fast.

[OCtoCincy 0]

<b>Streetcar Schedule Update:</b>

 

By April 1st, the following will be completed.

 

WALNUT STREET  - all the way from government place (today) through the curve onto 2nd street.  Walnut will be entirely completed. This wasn't originally the plan, as the 2nd street curve wasn't supposed to happen till the fall but now it is scheduled for late March.

 

MAIN STREET  - The curve from 12th and the straight track to Central Parkway. Possibly across Central Parkway if things go very well.

 

OTR LOOP  - Overhead wire system for all of OTR would be completed by April 1.  This includes the Diamond intersection.

______________

 

VEHICLES  - Vehicle #2 carshell set arrived to the CAF Elmira plant December 2.  Vehicle #3 carshell set will arrive in early February. Vehicle 4 shipped Jan 19 and will arrive Feb 25, Vehicle 5 will arrive in Elmira April 2. First vehicle is still on track for a Sept 15, 2015 delivery

 

OPERATIONS  - SORTA should have a signed operator by the end of June. The ticket vending machines should be delivered in 4Q 2015, with testing and installation by May 2016.  This is a big deal, because Atlanta is offering their system free for 3 months, not because they want to, but because they haven't gotten ticket vending machines yet... I'm hoping Cincinnati does 2 weeks free, then begins paid service on Oct 1, meaning all those gift cards would start on the first of a month, etc. So a 60 day pass gets you all of Oct and all of November ending on Nov 30.

 

[jmecklenborg 511]

Do the streetcar exteriors exist yet?  I am curious to see the paint color. 

[Eigth and State 0]

First vehicle is still on track for a Sept 15, 2015 delivery

 

:-D

 

 

 

[jjakucyk 142]

First vehicle is still on track for a Sept 15, 2015 delivery

 

:-D

 

 

[ryanlammi 360]

First vehicle is still on track for a Sept 15, 2015 delivery

 

:-D

 

[thebillshark 89]

Most of you have already seen my proposal for the Uptown Four.  That idea started off as thinking about a streetcar route for Uptown and eventually ended up as a frequent transit bus network that connects to the Cincinnati Streetcar at University Plaza.  On this network there would be ten minute or less headways between vehicles (including the streetcar) and fare structure would be the same as the streetcar, $1 for two hours, with free transfers between lines. I have been posting about this idea on news articles about Uptown developments with this file: http://goo.gl/awheu8

 

Anyway this weekend I made a map and list that shows the recently announced and in progress developments Uptown that this network would serve. They are marked by the blue circles on the map:

 

 

Item

Project

Description

Link

1Clifton MarketCo-op grocery store https://cliftonmarket.com/news/b3b7f56c01

2Gaslight Manor117 Luxury Apartmentshttp://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2014/12/17/17-million-upscale-apartment-project-coming-to.html

3Gilbane W McMillan St. Apts.180 apartments, mixed use building w parking garagehttp://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2014/12/10/council-approves-rezoning-of-site-near-uc-for.html?page=all

4Fairfeild Inn & Suites115 room hotelhttp://www.cincinnati.com/story/money/business/2014/08/29/usquare-uptown-hotel/14758121/

5101 East Corry108 apartmentshttp://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/blog/2014/11/25-million-apartment-project-coming-to-uptown.html?page=all

6VP3147 apartmentshttp://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/morning_call/2014/06/30m-complex-contributes-to-cincinnati.html?page=all

7Auburn Ave Medical building50,000 sq. ft. medical buildinghttp://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/print-edition/2014/11/14/mount-auburn-a-lost-neighborhood-gets-new-love.html?page=all

8Wellington Place renovate 60 Apts & build 200 newhttp://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/print-edition/2014/11/14/mount-auburn-a-lost-neighborhood-gets-new-love.html?page=all

9Christ Hospital Joint and Spine Center355,000 sq. ft. Hospital expansionhttp://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2014/11/11/exclusive-ceo-leads-hard-hat-tour-of-cincinnati.html

10New Anna Louise Inn/Women's Drop InnSocial serviceshttp://www.wlwt.com/news/new-womens-drop-inn-center-under-construction/28151548

11Avondale Townhomes8 townhomeshttp://www.urbancincy.com/2014/11/uptown-leaders-hoping-2-4m-northern-townhomes-project-accelerates-avondales-rebirth/

12TCB Avondale apartments and grocery72 apartments and groceryhttp://www.cincinnati-oh.gov/planning/about-city-planning-buildings/city-planning-commission/feb-6-2015-packet/

13TCB Apartments portfolio of properties received historic tax creditshttp://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/gallery/135081?r=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.bizjournals.com%2Fcincinnati%2Fnews%2F2014%2F12%2F19%2Fgreater-cincinnati-projects-awarded-5-5-million-in.html

14Green Man ParkNew park being built by citizen volunteershttp://www.urbancincy.com/2014/11/new-green-man-park-to-transform-formerly-vacant-lot-in-peebles-corner/

15Towne Apartments96 apartmentshttp://www.cincinnati-oh.gov/planning/about-city-planning-buildings/city-planning-commission/feb-6-2015-packet/

16Evanston homes 40 single family homes rehabbed by Port Authorityhttp://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/blog/2015/01/port-uthority-hopes-evanston-rehab-shows-it-can.html

17University Station    Phase 2

Hotel & Officehttp://www.cbre.us/o/cincinnati/AssetLibrary/University_LR.pdf

 

[mrnyc 406]

something positive and interesting via ssp!

 

if milwaukee moves forward on its plan to have the line under construction by the end of this year, then that would make four midwest cities constructing their streetcar starter lines at the same time!

 

- Cincinnati - 3.6 mile starter lin - U/C

 

- Detroit - 3.3 mile starter line - U/C

 

- Milwaukee - 2.5 mile starter line - Approved

 

- Kansas City - 2.0 mile starter line - U/C

 

not bad at all. it would leave Indy and Columbus as the only midwest metros over 1M people without any form of rail transit, though columbus is once again toying with a streetcar/light rail plan.

 

[thebillshark 89]

something positive and interesting via ssp!

 

if milwaukee moves forward on its plan to have the line under construction by the end of this year, then that would make four midwest cities constructing their streetcar starter lines at the same time!

 

- Cincinnati - 3.6 mile starter lin - U/C

 

- Detroit - 3.3 mile starter line - U/C

 

- Milwaukee - 2.5 mile starter line - Approved

 

- Kansas City - 2.0 mile starter line - U/C

 

not bad at all. it would leave Indy and Columbus as the only midwest metros over 1M people without any form of rail transit, though columbus is once again toying with a streetcar/light rail plan.

 

I wonder if Milwaukee will use CAF cars like us & KC and if we could combine future streetcar orders to save $.

[taestell 726]

Cincinnati's contract included options for ~20 additional vehicles (I don't recall the exact number). Kansas City used some of those options. We need to save some of those options for future route extensions so hopefully we don't give any more out to other cities.

[thebillshark 89]

 

Here is my concept for an Ezzard Charles Drive "Cincinnati Icons" West End Streetcar. The track travels in both directions along Ezzard Charles (Purple Line in diagram.) At Central Avenue the eastbound tracks make a left turn onto Central Ave., and perform a clockwise loop around 14th St, Race St, 12th St, and back to Central Ave. and Ezzard Charles drive.  It is possible to connect to the northbound main streetcar line at Music Hall; a new stop on the south side of 14th would allow travelers to disembark and cross Elm St. to wait at the existing Music Hall stop for a northbound streetcar.  The new loop would tie into the existing streetcar track on Race and use the existing 12th and Race stop for travelers to make a connection to the southbound streetcar.

 

The new line would require cutting into existing track to lay an x crosspiece at 14th and Elm, a tie into existing track at 14th and Race, use of the existing "Washington Park Junction" to make the turn from Race to 12th, and stub out to let the streetcar continue straight on 12th at Elm to return to the West End. There would also be a spot where the new track crosses over itself on Central Ave. making a left hand turn onto Ezzard Charles. 

 

I thought about making the loop counterclockwise onto Elm St. but decided against it for the following reasons.  First, if there was new stop on 12th to make a connection to the southbound streetcar, it would still require walking a whole block across the Park to the 12th and Race stop.  Secondly, every turn on a counterclockwise loop would be a left hand turn; on a clockwise loop they are all right hand turns except the turns from and to Ezzard Charles.  Three is that it might make for some awkward track geometries when tying into existing track (Thinking specifically of the left turn onto Elm.)   

 

I am most excited about this line when I think about improved intercity rail service operating out of Union Terminal. I can imagine trains of tourists from Chicago and Indianapolis arriving at Union Terminal being able to enjoy a completely car-free weekend in Cincinnati because of the streetcar. This would also be good for tourists staying downtown to reach the Museum Center.

 

The biggest drawback in my view, besides the construction downtime to the streetcar system caused by tying into existing track, is that it would take two streetcars in continual operation to keep the headways under 10 minutes.  This would be costly and probably not justified by current demand in the area. Most of the functionality of this line would lie in the ability to make a quick connection to and from the existing system; I feel twenty minute headways (from one streetcar) would be inadequate for this task.

 

There is plenty of room for future development in the West End that could eventually justify the costs of running the line however. I can see some denser mixed use development with commercial space along Ezzard Charles, in the current streetcar construction yard.  They could fill in around the Laurel Park semi-circle with multi-unit buildings.  There are parcels of land sprinkled throughout the City West area that could support development. There are some lots on the NW corner of Linn and Ezzard Charles.  Also, there are built out storefronts on Lynn, part of the City West development, that sit mostly vacant save for a lone cell phone store, which could blossom someday. 

 

[OCtoCincy 0]

Somebody asked about color of the vehicles.  Here is the only image that actually shows the "daffodil" that will be on our cars

 

 

Here is how it looked last week.

 

 

and the console:

[thomasbw 63]

Somebody asked about color of the vehicles.  Here is the only image that actually shows the "daffodil" that will be on our cars

 

 

 

 

These are going to look sharp.

 

I just got back from Spain and rode a bunch of CAF cars. Madrid only had the CAF Heavy Rail Cars and Barcelona had streetcars but they were Alstom because the Catalans hate the Spanish, but I was very pleased with the CAF vehicles.

 

(Unrelated news, the new German U-Bahn cars are the nicest public transportation vehicles I have ever seen

 

)

[IAGuy39 48]

I know this isn't completely relevant to Cincinnati, and maybe I should post on the thread "What other states are doing with Rail", but it is in the Atlanta Journal Constitution series comparing Atlanta vs. Charlotte and Dallas.  I haven't read the Dallas article yet, but it talks of the successes of Charlotte and their regional plan for a concentrated downtown (Uptown Charlotte), and how their light rail line, their light rail extension and their current East to West Streetcar system is a big part of their success, specifically in creating a dense, urban area.

 

Charlotte is actually around the same size as Cincinnati metro wise.  Now I have never been to Charlotte, or Atlanta for that matter so I can't really compare Cincinnati to them.  But I think it is an interesting article showing the importance of a dense, walkable urban core.  Once we get to uptown and Northern Kentucky on our line, we will be more in line with Charlotte.  Keep in mind though, Charlotte is growing exponentially faster than Cincinnati.

 

http://www.ajc.com/news/business/charlottes-strength-lies-at-its-core/nj6Dj/

 

Disclaimer:  I wish the Enquirer would do a highly in depth article comparing Cincinnati to it's regional competitors, possibly Indianapolis and Nashville or Columbus?

 

 

[jjakucyk 142]

The big difference between Cincinnati (and other older cities) and these sunbelt boomtowns is how quickly the sunbelt cities devolve into low-density single-family residential neighborhoods.  Instead of several miles of older neighborhoods that went through at least one or two eras of redevelopment and densification like OTR, Uptown, Northside, Price Hill, Walnut Hills, and of course Covington, Newport, and Bellevue, you instead go immediately from downtown to the equivalent of Evanston or Bond Hill, with another quick transition again to ranch-dominated inner suburbs, all of which can be quite depressed by now.  Cincinnati even has some rather dense manufacturing suburbs more like what you'd find in Massachusetts or Pennsylvania such as Lockland and Reading, which are that much more rare in the south.  So because the southern core city was originally fairly small and sprawl runs rampant with very restrictive zoning even quite close to downtown, there's enormous pressure to maximize development in the allowable downtown areas, so it's a bit more peaky than you get here.

[jmecklenborg 511]

In the South there are almost no walkable neighborhoods outside of the various downtowns.  There are the famous historic areas of New Orleans and Savannah and Charleston and Miami Beach, and that's basically it.  Cincinnati might have more walkable 18th and early 19th century residential areas than the entire south combined. 

[jmecklenborg 511]

Also the famous historic areas are very small -- smaller than OTR.  The French Quarter, Savannah, Charleston, etc. are all smaller than a square mile and nowhere near as dense. 

[Htsguy 655]

I know this isn't completely relevant to Cincinnati, and maybe I should post on the thread "What other states are doing with Rail", but it is in the Atlanta Journal Constitution series comparing Atlanta vs. Charlotte and Dallas.  I haven't read the Dallas article yet, but it talks of the successes of Charlotte and their regional plan for a concentrated downtown (Uptown Charlotte), and how their light rail line, their light rail extension and their current East to West Streetcar system is a big part of their success, specifically in creating a dense, urban area.

 

Charlotte is actually around the same size as Cincinnati metro wise.  Now I have never been to Charlotte, or Atlanta for that matter so I can't really compare Cincinnati to them.  But I think it is an interesting article showing the importance of a dense, walkable urban core.  Once we get to uptown and Northern Kentucky on our line, we will be more in line with Charlotte.  Keep in mind though, Charlotte is growing exponentially faster than Cincinnati.

 

http://www.ajc.com/news/business/charlottes-strength-lies-at-its-core/nj6Dj/

 

Disclaimer:  I wish the Enquirer would do a highly in depth article comparing Cincinnati to it's regional competitors, possibly Indianapolis and Nashville or Columbus?

 

 

 

That is the first time on this board I have ever heard anybody describe Charlotte as dense and walkable.  I recall a few years ago some thread that went on and on about Charlotte, and the venom was incredible (including by posters who had lived or been raised there).

[IAGuy39 48]

I know this isn't completely relevant to Cincinnati, and maybe I should post on the thread "What other states are doing with Rail", but it is in the Atlanta Journal Constitution series comparing Atlanta vs. Charlotte and Dallas.  I haven't read the Dallas article yet, but it talks of the successes of Charlotte and their regional plan for a concentrated downtown (Uptown Charlotte), and how their light rail line, their light rail extension and their current East to West Streetcar system is a big part of their success, specifically in creating a dense, urban area.

 

Charlotte is actually around the same size as Cincinnati metro wise.  Now I have never been to Charlotte, or Atlanta for that matter so I can't really compare Cincinnati to them.  But I think it is an interesting article showing the importance of a dense, walkable urban core.  Once we get to uptown and Northern Kentucky on our line, we will be more in line with Charlotte.  Keep in mind though, Charlotte is growing exponentially faster than Cincinnati.

 

http://www.ajc.com/news/business/charlottes-strength-lies-at-its-core/nj6Dj/

 

Disclaimer:  I wish the Enquirer would do a highly in depth article comparing Cincinnati to it's regional competitors, possibly Indianapolis and Nashville or Columbus?

 

 

 

That is the first time on this board I have ever heard anybody describe Charlotte as dense and walkable.  I recall a few years ago some thread that went on and on about Charlotte, and the venom was incredible (including by posters who had lived or been raised there).

 

I never described Charlotte as being dense and walkable.  I simply was paraphrasing the article on the Atlanta Journal Constitution for discussion.  I said I hadn't been there before and can't compare Cincinnati to it, but that I thought it was an interesting article showing the importance of dense, walkable urban cores, which the article talks about.  I then said "Once we get to uptown and Northern Kentucky, we will be more in line with Charlotte."  What I meant was, in terms of how extensive our rail transit is, if that is what you mistook me as saying ".. describe Charlotte as dense and walkable."

 

Thanks.

[Civvik 0]

You could say that Charlotte and Atlanta don't have historically dense urban cores like Cincinnati, but that doesn't say much because MOST American cities don't have that. MOST American metros are also growing much faster than Cincinnati. This really makes comparison of little value.

 

Charlotte type cities have crappy bones but healthy market demand (+450,000 MSA/10 years), making it easier for urban developers to build more expensive, riskier projects. Cincinnati type cities have wonderful bones but anemic market demand (+130,000 MSA/10 years), putting developers in a weird position of being surrounded by an embarrassment of historic riches but barely able to cobble together financing for entry-level quality urban infill, especially when its not supported by large institutional backers like UC or state and federal grants.

 

I think Cincinnati's current direction of slow, thoughtful, mid-level renovation of its historic city neighborhood centers is the best match for the region's circumstances. We could build out 5 streetcar lines in the next 10 years, but I don't know that the growth would fuel much action on that much infrastructure at once. I mean, even the Charlotte south line is taking time to build up that corridor.

[taestell 726]

I think Cincinnati's current direction of slow, thoughtful, mid-level renovation of its historic city neighborhood centers is the best match for the region's circumstances. We could build out 5 streetcar lines in the next 10 years, but I don't know that the growth would fuel much action on that much infrastructure at once. I mean, even the Charlotte south line is taking time to build up that corridor.

 

This is why I disagree with the people who say that "the streetcar must be extended to UC to be successful".  Of course that would be great from a pure transportation perspective. But I think the best scenario is that Phase 1A is up and running for a few years to encourage density in the CBD, OTR, and the eastern edge of the West End. Then we can expand to Uptown and Northern Kentucky and start expanding the density outward.

[IAGuy39 48]

I think Cincinnati's current direction of slow, thoughtful, mid-level renovation of its historic city neighborhood centers is the best match for the region's circumstances. We could build out 5 streetcar lines in the next 10 years, but I don't know that the growth would fuel much action on that much infrastructure at once. I mean, even the Charlotte south line is taking time to build up that corridor.

 

This is why I disagree with the people who say that "the streetcar must be extended to UC to be successful".  Of course that would be great from a pure transportation perspective. But I think the best scenario is that Phase 1A is up and running for a few years to encourage density in the CBD, OTR, and the eastern edge of the West End. Then we can expand to Uptown and Northern Kentucky and start expanding the density outward.

 

On Google Streetview in Charlotte you can see there is some apartment projects close in along the line going south but they dissipate rather quickly.  If you turn off the line you run into single family, large lot housing.

 

I think the streetcar will be a success in downtown and OTR alone, but I think development will be greatly accelerated in downtown / OTR if it connects to the job centers in Uptown.  This is because then, all of the workers in Uptown can decide for themselves if they want to live in a car free environment.  You are basically connecting the middle (OTR) with the two poles (downtown and uptown). 

 

Now I am not saying it will double the demand, because there will always be demand to live downtown and OTR who don't work there.  But it will increase demand for new developments.

[ajknee 4]

I think Cincinnati's current direction of slow, thoughtful, mid-level renovation of its historic city neighborhood centers is the best match for the region's circumstances. We could build out 5 streetcar lines in the next 10 years, but I don't know that the growth would fuel much action on that much infrastructure at once. I mean, even the Charlotte south line is taking time to build up that corridor.

 

This is why I disagree with the people who say that "the streetcar must be extended to UC to be successful".  Of course that would be great from a pure transportation perspective. But I think the best scenario is that Phase 1A is up and running for a few years to encourage density in the CBD, OTR, and the eastern edge of the West End. Then we can expand to Uptown and Northern Kentucky and start expanding the density outward.

 

We have to remember that the only reason we have a streetcar is because the current federal administration is dishing out TIGER grants for urban circulators. In two years, who knows if the next administration will keep the program going. That doesn't mean we should stop planning, it just means we need to be planning an entire system of streetcars, BRT, Light Rail, etc (MetroMoves?) and apply for funding as it comes available. If we don't snag a grant for Uptown in the next two years it's anyone's guess if it'll ever happen.

[FakeCinEnquirer 0]

I think Cincinnati's current direction of slow, thoughtful, mid-level renovation of its historic city neighborhood centers is the best match for the region's circumstances. We could build out 5 streetcar lines in the next 10 years, but I don't know that the growth would fuel much action on that much infrastructure at once. I mean, even the Charlotte south line is taking time to build up that corridor.

 

This is why I disagree with the people who say that "the streetcar must be extended to UC to be successful".  Of course that would be great from a pure transportation perspective. But I think the best scenario is that Phase 1A is up and running for a few years to encourage density in the CBD, OTR, and the eastern edge of the West End. Then we can expand to Uptown and Northern Kentucky and start expanding the density outward.

 

apply for funding as it comes available. If we don't snag a grant for Uptown in the next two years it's anyone's guess if it'll ever happen.

 

Absolutely will not happen while john cranley is mayor.

 

There will be no applications from cincinnati for any federal grants regarding any new passenger rail related plans.  The politics isn't there.

 

I highly doubt cranley allows any applications For federal grants for the streetcar to help with operating costs either.  He's got too much politically at stake to help it

[jmicha 28]

And thankfully he isn't the only one with a say. Just like he had no desire to continue construction but was outnumbered by leveler heads.

 

It's still not likely, but John Cranley isn't the only deciding factor in what happens in the future of rail transit here.

[taestell 726]

And thankfully he isn't the only one with a say. Just like he had no desire to continue construction but was outnumbered by leveler heads.

 

It's still not likely, but John Cranley isn't the only deciding factor in what happens in the future of rail transit here.

 

Unless the Strong Mayor amendment bring proposed by Smitherman passes.

[brian korte 12]

Unless the Strong Mayor amendment bring proposed by Smitherman passes.

 

Even under that scenario a super majority of Council still sets the policy.

[John Schneider 0]

I think Cincinnati's current direction of slow, thoughtful, mid-level renovation of its historic city neighborhood centers is the best match for the region's circumstances. We could build out 5 streetcar lines in the next 10 years, but I don't know that the growth would fuel much action on that much infrastructure at once. I mean, even the Charlotte south line is taking time to build up that corridor.

 

This is why I disagree with the people who say that "the streetcar must be extended to UC to be successful".  Of course that would be great from a pure transportation perspective. But I think the best scenario is that Phase 1A is up and running for a few years to encourage density in the CBD, OTR, and the eastern edge of the West End. Then we can expand to Uptown and Northern Kentucky and start expanding the density outward.

 

apply for funding as it comes available. If we don't snag a grant for Uptown in the next two years it's anyone's guess if it'll ever happen.

 

Absolutely will not happen while john cranley is mayor.

 

There will be no applications from cincinnati for any federal grants regarding any new passenger rail related plans.  The politics isn't there.

 

I highly doubt cranley allows any applications For federal grants for the streetcar to help with operating costs either.  He's got too much politically at stake to help it

 

^ That's a pretty good read on the situation. You need a strong advocate in the mayor's chair to make rail happen, not just in Cincinnati but anywhere in the United States. Most people have no idea how many blocks Mallory and Dohoney threw for us to make the streetcar happen, constant lobbying of Washington among them. Even if Cranley didn't oppose it, but instead just didn't help to advance it, there's no way we'd get more Federal money. Plus Cincinnati now has a bad rep with the FTA which may take years to overcome. I agree with Travis, we're going to have to make the Downtown/OTR streetcar a resounding success and maybe have to wait until Cranley moves on. Wish it weren't so.

[jmecklenborg 511]

^ That's a pretty good read on the situation. You need a strong advocate in the mayor's chair to make rail happen, not just in Cincinnati but anywhere in the United States. Most people have no idea how many blocks Mallory and Dohoney threw for us to make the streetcar happen, constant lobbying of Washington among them. Even if Cranley didn't oppose it, but instead just didn't help to advance it, there's no way we'd get more Federal money. Plus Cincinnati now has a bad rep with the FTA which may take years to overcome. I agree with Travis, we're going to have to make the Downtown/OTR streetcar a resounding success and maybe have to wait until Cranley moves on. Wish it weren't so.

 

The rate at which some of the blocks along the streetcar route are being redeveloped is pretty solid.  Save a massive national recession the blocks surrounding the streetcar line in OTR will be almost fully built-out before Cranley leaves office, assuming he's here for seven more years.  The whole time everyone will see the success and keep asking him when it's going to expand. 

 

 

[neilworms 20]

^ That's a pretty good read on the situation. You need a strong advocate in the mayor's chair to make rail happen, not just in Cincinnati but anywhere in the United States. Most people have no idea how many blocks Mallory and Dohoney threw for us to make the streetcar happen, constant lobbying of Washington among them. Even if Cranley didn't oppose it, but instead just didn't help to advance it, there's no way we'd get more Federal money. Plus Cincinnati now has a bad rep with the FTA which may take years to overcome. I agree with Travis, we're going to have to make the Downtown/OTR streetcar a resounding success and maybe have to wait until Cranley moves on. Wish it weren't so.

 

The rate at which some of the blocks along the streetcar route are being redeveloped is pretty solid.  Save a massive national recession the blocks surrounding the streetcar line in OTR will be almost fully built-out before Cranley leaves office, assuming he's here for seven more years.  The whole time everyone will see the success and keep asking him when it's going to expand. 

 

 

 

Are you implying that he'll be a two term Mayor?  Scary thoughts.

[John Schneider 0]

^ That's a pretty good read on the situation. You need a strong advocate in the mayor's chair to make rail happen, not just in Cincinnati but anywhere in the United States. Most people have no idea how many blocks Mallory and Dohoney threw for us to make the streetcar happen, constant lobbying of Washington among them. Even if Cranley didn't oppose it, but instead just didn't help to advance it, there's no way we'd get more Federal money. Plus Cincinnati now has a bad rep with the FTA which may take years to overcome. I agree with Travis, we're going to have to make the Downtown/OTR streetcar a resounding success and maybe have to wait until Cranley moves on. Wish it weren't so.

 

The rate at which some of the blocks along the streetcar route are being redeveloped is pretty solid.  Save a massive national recession the blocks surrounding the streetcar line in OTR will be almost fully built-out before Cranley leaves office, assuming he's here for seven more years.  The whole time everyone will see the success and keep asking him when it's going to expand. 

 

 

 

Are you implying that he'll be a two term Mayor?  Scary thoughts.

 

^ Yes, almost certainly.

[ryanlammi 360]

^ That's a pretty good read on the situation. You need a strong advocate in the mayor's chair to make rail happen, not just in Cincinnati but anywhere in the United States. Most people have no idea how many blocks Mallory and Dohoney threw for us to make the streetcar happen, constant lobbying of Washington among them. Even if Cranley didn't oppose it, but instead just didn't help to advance it, there's no way we'd get more Federal money. Plus Cincinnati now has a bad rep with the FTA which may take years to overcome. I agree with Travis, we're going to have to make the Downtown/OTR streetcar a resounding success and maybe have to wait until Cranley moves on. Wish it weren't so.

 

The rate at which some of the blocks along the streetcar route are being redeveloped is pretty solid.  Save a massive national recession the blocks surrounding the streetcar line in OTR will be almost fully built-out before Cranley leaves office, assuming he's here for seven more years.  The whole time everyone will see the success and keep asking him when it's going to expand. 

 

 

 

Are you implying that he'll be a two term Mayor?  Scary thoughts.

 

^ Yes, almost certainly.

 

Let's not get ahead of ourselves. Someone could replace Cranley.

 

From the election discussion:

 

^ Couple of things:

 

(1) Cranley isn't going to win. He's already losing some important corporate support because people realize there is nothing there.

...

I think as Cincinnatians come to understand this, Cranley will seem like he doesn't know what he is talking about.

[jmecklenborg 511]

Cranley's going to look like a fool when barhopping on the streetcar between Taft's Ale House and Rhinegeist becomes one of the most popular ways to impress out-of-town guests. 

[jmicha 28]

I actually think that's what'll cause a push for later running hours on weekends. Barhopping between those major nodes plus whatever develops between it in addition to anything else that already exists nearby on Republic and Vine is going to really require late night service.

[neilworms 20]

Cranley's going to look like a fool when barhopping on the streetcar between Taft's Ale House and Rhinegeist becomes one of the most popular ways to impress out-of-town guests. 

 

Even more impressive would be from Moerlein Lager House to Rhinegeist, with the 21C Rooftop Terrace in between.  Cincinnati's core is shaping up to be pretty awesome.  Its rumored Rhinegeist will get a rooftop bar as well.

[taestell 726]

Someone needs to produce a two-sided map and drop them off at businesses along the route. One side will show late night destinations along the route (breweries, bars, restaurants). The other will show the daytime destinations (museums, shopping, etc.).

 

This would also be a great thing to hand to anyone on the street you overhear say "it doesn't go anywhere."

[jwulsin 84]

^The problem with printed maps is they become obsolete each few months as new places keep opening up.

[taestell 726]

I would not recommend putting actual restaurant names on the map. Keep it to "Backstage District restaurants" and "Gateway Quarter restaurant and bar district".  (Unless some particular establishments wanted to sponsor the map and get their individual business listed... hmm...)

 

But I think having physical, pamphlet-sized handouts at places like Rhinegeist is critical. The streetcar will finally click in a lot of peoples' minds when they look at a map and realize, "oh, I can take the streetcar to [insert destination]?"

[thomasbw 63]

Someone needs to produce a two-sided map and drop them off at businesses along the route. One side will show late night destinations along the route (breweries, bars, restaurants). The other will show the daytime destinations (museums, shopping, etc.).

 

This would also be a great thing to hand to anyone on the street you overhear say "it doesn't go anywhere."

 

 

here's a good example- http://www.portlandstreetcar.org/node/34

 

less good- http://www.thrillist.com/drink/portland/portland-s-first-transit-booze-map