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RTA payed $10 million for 117 machines and 13 kiosks, so about $77,000 per machine.

 

I looked at other reports from other cities and found that a ticket machine that can use smart cards costs about $55,000 each and ones that cant cost about $13,000 per unit. Why are RTA's machines so expensive?

 

And since the machines only last 10 to 15 years, and RTA doesn't seem to plan on having smart cards anytime soon, maybe the $13,000 machines would have been a smarter decision.

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And since the machines only last 10 to 15 years, and RTA doesn't seem to plan on having smart cards anytime soon, maybe the $13,000 machines would have been a smarter decision.

 

 

Funding for conversion to smart cards is in NOACA's TIP for 2014-2017.


"Life is 10% what happens to you and 90% how you respond." -- Coach Lou Holtz

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Maybe teenagers used the Rapid a long time ago to get to/from school, but I don't see them on the Rapid today.

 

I see John Hay students getting on and off at University Circle all the time.  Fwiw, they're frequently somewhat loud and rowdy, but I never see fighting or even really hear much vulgarity.  I see rowdier teens coming from farther east than University Circle, but I don't know if they're in school or where.

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And since the machines only last 10 to 15 years, and RTA doesn't seem to plan on having smart cards anytime soon, maybe the $13,000 machines would have been a smarter decision.

 

 

Funding for conversion to smart cards is in NOACA's TIP for 2014-2017.

 

Does that mean we will have smart cards by 2017, or will it take longer? Even so if it takes till 2017, the machines will be near the end of their life, if they even last that long. I feel like it would have been smarter to just buy the cheaper machines and worry about smart cards once we had funding in place. Any idea why our machines cost more, even though they apparently were built with inferior materials?

 

Change in subject. Here is an article from 2010 which says the speed issues should be addressed in a couple of months. Based on my experiences, nothing has changed. Its a shame because I would really love a good transportation system from University Circle to Downtown. BRT is not what I was hoping for but it could be so much better! I would take the Red line but the stations aren't convenient(excited for the new mayfield rd station) and the only downtown station is Tower City which is far from where I have been traveling.

 

HealthLine buses moving slower than expected on Euclid Avenue

CLEVELAND, Ohio -- RTA's HealthLine -- a bus/rapid transit touted as a faster, more efficient way to travel Euclid Avenue -- is moving at about the same slow pace as the bus it replaced.

 

Cleveland is still adjusting traffic lights on Euclid Avenue from Public Square to the Stokes/Windermere rapid station in East

Cleveland to shorten the bus trips, nearly two years after the $200 million Euclid Corridor project was completed.

 

A westbound bus ride during weekday mornings and evening rush hours along the 7.1-mile corridor averaged 44 minutes instead of the 33 minutes it is supposed to take, according to the latest data provided by the Greater Cleveland Regional Transit Authority for the first three months of this year.

 

The 44 minutes was just three minutes faster than the No. 6 bus that the HealthLine replaced.

 

http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/2010/07/healthline_buses_moving_slower.html

 

 

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The budget period and the implementation period may or may not be the same. Depends on the contract award and implementation process.


"Life is 10% what happens to you and 90% how you respond." -- Coach Lou Holtz

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Maybe teenagers used the Rapid a long time ago to get to/from school, but I don't see them on the Rapid today.

 

The

Maybe teenagers used the Rapid a long time ago to get to/from school, but I don't see them on the Rapid today.

 

I see John Hay students getting on and off at University Circle all the time.  Fwiw, they're frequently somewhat loud and rowdy, but I never see fighting or even really hear much vulgarity.  I see rowdier teens coming from farther east than University Circle, but I don't know if they're in school or where.

 

John Hay kids might as well be St. Ignatius kids.  That's basically a magnet school for the studious.

 

The HS kids may not have had a major presence lately, but BITD they knocked Red Line ridership down even faster than their own numbers "boosted" it, and it never recovered.  IIRC, there have been recent proposals to bring them back.

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The HS kids may not have had a major presence lately, but BITD they knocked Red Line ridership down even faster than their own numbers "boosted" it, and it never recovered.

 

GCRTA data shows Red Line ridership is at its highest levels since the 1970s. What data are you citing?


"Life is 10% what happens to you and 90% how you respond." -- Coach Lou Holtz

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Contrast the photo on the prior page to Seattle Bus arrival info + off-board payment via Orca Card (on other side). Orca is the smart card that can be used on multiple transit systems in the Puget Sound area....

 

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"Life is 10% what happens to you and 90% how you respond." -- Coach Lou Holtz

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So does RTA constantly get screwed over, or are they just making the dumbest decisions in which no one is held responsible for? Here are some the issues I have noticed and read about. I bet many of you can add countless others.

 

Ticket Machines

• 1 year delay due to problems during testing

• Confusing, not user friendly. Required a new system which took years to get

• Rusting since non-rusting steel was not used like the contract required

• Damaged exterior since the cheap red sticker like material was used

• Debit/credit card payment not working on all machines

 

Healthline Stations

• Lack any protection from the elements. Sealed corners were not used.

• Beginning to rust

 

Healthline Bus

• There used to be a bar in middle of the aisle in the front portion of the bus where the priority seating is located. These have since been removed, which I assume is because they made it harder for those in wheelchairs to maneuver to the handicap section.

• Wheelchair ramps already broken on a lot of the busses.

• Brakes squealing

• Other wear and tear issues (Horn no longer functioning, etc.)

• Slow, trip times not living up to expectations

 

NextConnect

• Useless information. Does not provide real time location, gives scheduled time instead.

• No mobile version

• Reinventing the wheel, but making it a square. The real time transit location program already exists. NextBus is used by countless transit agencies all over the US and Canada and actually works.

 

 

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Contrast the photo on the prior page to Seattle Bus arrival info + off-board payment via Orca Card (on other side). Orca is the smart card that can be used on multiple transit systems in the Puget Sound area....

 

That Seattle display is awesome. Even aside from their accuracy, RTA's next connect LED displays are truly the worst format I've seen for conveying the info. Having to watch a scrolling sign to find the info you actually want is not much of a hardship, but still annoying.

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I truly don't understand why RTA made the decisions it made with POP.  I'd have to believe it's a limited marketplace of suppliers of said equipment.  How hard is it to look at the top transit systems in the world and borrow from their technology? 

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POP systems are very common and the marketplace for the equipment is big and growing.

 

BTW, the reason why POP is so popular and why GCRTA joined other cities in implementing it is because it allowed them to save a lot of money by no longer staffing the Red Line stations. The full-day labor costs (including benefits, retirement etc) is about $125K-150K per year. That's 17 stations, saving some $2.1 million to $2.5 million per year.


"Life is 10% what happens to you and 90% how you respond." -- Coach Lou Holtz

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FYI, just looking through NOACA's TIP which shows $146.5 million in rail capital and preventative maintenance expenditures budgeted for 2014-17......

 

http://www.noaca.org/modules/showdocument.aspx?documentid=757

 

$ 3.0M = LRT Blue/Green Line bridge over CSX/East93rd

$ 1.8M = Rail SOGR

$30.0M = Rail preventative maintenance

$ 5.5M = LRT vehicle reliability/SOGR

$ 4.0M = East 120th substation replacement-Red Line

$ 3.9M = West 117th substation replacement-Red Line

$ 0.7M = Sectionalize Tower City catenary

$ 2.1M = Second feed for East55th substation

$40.0M = Blue Line extension

$ 3.6M = Puritas substation replace-Red Line

$ 6.0M = Rail infrastructure program

$ 4.4M = LRT replace 9 street crossings

$ 1.0M = Mayfield Road transit station construction-Red Line

$12.3M = Brookpard Road transit station rehab-Red Line

$20.4M = LRT cab signaling East79th-Shaker Square

$ 4.7M = LRT East 116th station rehab-Blue/Green Lines

$ 1.0M = Signal system replacement-Red Line

$ 1.0M = Cab signal replacement-Red Line

$ 1.1M = LRT station platform reconstruction in Shaker Hts

 

$146.5 million TOTAL rail

 

$40.0M = Blue Line extension

 

This is interesting. Is this really going to happen? If so, it's the first rail extension in centuries. Centuries. $40M isn't much, I know, but is it just one or two more stations further east?

 

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$40.0M = Blue Line extension

 

This is interesting. Is this really going to happen? If so, it's the first rail extension in centuries. Centuries. $40M isn't much, I know, but is it just one or two more stations further east?

 

It's in the budget, although NOACA shows the $40 million coming from all local funds. So we'll see. This will extend the Blue Line from the NW side of the Chagrin/Warrensville intersection (site of the Van Aken District TOD http://shakeronline.com/departments/planning/van-aken) to the SE side of the intersection including a new intermodal transportation center.

 

Cleveland-area rail transit extensions in reverse order:

 

1996: Waterfront Line extended 2.2 miles

1968: CTS Rapid (today's Red Line) extended 4 miles from West Park station to Cleveland Airport

1958: CTS Rapid extended 2 miles from West 117th station to West Park station

1955: CTS Rapid opened from West 117th to Windermere

1936: Shaker Rapid (today's Green Line) extended from Courtland to Green Road

1930: Shaker/Van Aken Rapid built into Cleveland Union Terminal (today's Tower City)

1922: Mayfield Road double-tracked streetcar line built east from Lee Road to Oakwood Drive

1920: Shaker/Van Aken Rapid built from Shaker Square west to East 34th streetcar connection

1913-16: much of Shaker/Van Aken Rapid built within Shaker Heights

1912: Madison Avenue streetcar line extended west from West 117th into rural southern part of Lakewood

Before that? Waaay too many rail extensions and new rail lines to list here.


"Life is 10% what happens to you and 90% how you respond." -- Coach Lou Holtz

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So does RTA constantly get screwed over, or are they just making the dumbest decisions in which no one is held responsible for? Here are some the issues I have noticed and read about. I bet many of you can add countless others.

 

....

 

NextConnect

• Useless information. Does not provide real time location, gives scheduled time instead.

• No mobile version

• Reinventing the wheel, but making it a square. The real time transit location program already exists. NextBus is used by countless transit agencies all over the US and Canada and actually works.

 

 

 

The NextConnect System is due to the back-end tracking system that RTA uses.  It is provided by a company called Trapeze Software.  They are limited by that system to what can be used.  While NextBus would be an improvement, they may not be able to provide a real time stream of their system data.  Also, while the NextConnect system may be extremely unfriendly to the user, the data may be correct.  It is tough to say though because there is no differentiation between when a displayed time is based on Real-Time Data or just the Route Schedule.

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So does RTA constantly get screwed over, or are they just making the dumbest decisions in which no one is held responsible for? Here are some the issues I have noticed and read about. I bet many of you can add countless others.

 

Ticket Machines

• 1 year delay due to problems during testing

• Confusing, not user friendly. Required a new system which took years to get

• Rusting since non-rusting steel was not used like the contract required

• Damaged exterior since the cheap red sticker like material was used

• Debit/credit card payment not working on all machines

 

Healthline Stations

• Lack any protection from the elements. Sealed corners were not used.

• Beginning to rust

 

Healthline Bus

• There used to be a bar in middle of the aisle in the front portion of the bus where the priority seating is located. These have since been removed, which I assume is because they made it harder for those in wheelchairs to maneuver to the handicap section.

• Wheelchair ramps already broken on a lot of the busses.

• Brakes squealing

• Other wear and tear issues (Horn no longer functioning, etc.)

• Slow, trip times not living up to expectations

 

NextConnect

• Useless information. Does not provide real time location, gives scheduled time instead.

• No mobile version

• Reinventing the wheel, but making it a square. The real time transit location program already exists. NextBus is used by countless transit agencies all over the US and Canada and actually works.

 

Im not sure if RTA read this or not but I think i'm on there kill list!  :-P

 

I was just driving on Euclid Avenue in University Circle and the Healthline started merging into me to avoid a parked car on the right lane. They would have hit me but I quickly got into the turning lane to avoid the accident.

 

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So does RTA constantly get screwed over, or are they just making the dumbest decisions in which no one is held responsible for? Here are some the issues I have noticed and read about. I bet many of you can add countless others.

 

....

 

NextConnect

• Useless information. Does not provide real time location, gives scheduled time instead.

• No mobile version

• Reinventing the wheel, but making it a square. The real time transit location program already exists. NextBus is used by countless transit agencies all over the US and Canada and actually works.

 

 

 

The NextConnect System is due to the back-end tracking system that RTA uses.  It is provided by a company called Trapeze Software.  They are limited by that system to what can be used.  While NextBus would be an improvement, they may not be able to provide a real time stream of their system data.  Also, while the NextConnect system may be extremely unfriendly to the user, the data may be correct.  It is tough to say though because there is no differentiation between when a displayed time is based on Real-Time Data or just the Route Schedule.

 

I can almost say with 100% certainty based my own experiences that for the Healthline and Red Line, nextconnect is always displaying the schedule only. Every time I use it I double check with the schedule and the three times line up exactly. I tried the same thing on the 32 the other day and got the same results. So although I cannot speak for the entire system, my experience alone, on some of the biggest routes, in addition to complaints I have seen online, point to the conclusion that for the most part, NextConnect does not actually display real time data.

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While waiting for a Red Line train the other day at West 117th, it seemed Next Connect appeared to be working interactively. GCRTA was single-tracking the Red Line at midday for maintenance, and the projected arrival time of my train stayed stuck at "in 5 minutes" for what seemed eternity. While I wasn't happy about that, I doubt the projected arrival time would have stayed stuck like that if it was only schedule-based.


"Life is 10% what happens to you and 90% how you respond." -- Coach Lou Holtz

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^ Are you speaking of the NextConnect website or the signs at the stations?

 

The signs at the stations are even more useless than NextConnect in my opinion. Those signs give information that is meaningless. The time stays the same, or goes down one minute every 2 minutes. It will say departing when there is no bus in sight. The time will reset back to 15 minutes randomly even if a second ago it said 4 minutes. They seem to be all over the place.

 

When waiting I have seen people get very upset over it when they are waiting and the sign jumps back up to 15 or 20 minutes. Or when it says departing when the bus is not even in sight. I saw a family downtown for winterfest who planned on using it and after waiting 40 minutes for the bus, and the sign constantly spitting out random numbers, they decided to walk to their car which they parked further down by Cleveland State I believe (they had several little kids).

 

To this day I still look at those signs as if they actually mean something. They are about as useful as pushing the button to cross the street in NYC I suppose!

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The signs at the stations.


"Life is 10% what happens to you and 90% how you respond." -- Coach Lou Holtz

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So I was just perusing some of GCRTA's Dual Hub planning documents from 1993. It noted that in 1988, 16,000 people every weekday used the reduced-fare (50-cents if I remember right) downtown Loop bus system -- the predecessor of today's free downtown Trolleys which carried 5,000 riders a day in 2012.

 

The same report also noted that buses on Euclid and Carnegie avenues went by an average of every 1.5 minutes in one direction during the two-hour morning rush hour. Throughout each day, these buses carried 54,000 riders per day. In 2012, the HealthLine carried 4.6 million riders, or 12,600 riders per day.

 

EDIT: while I realize the ridership on both the downtown Trolleys and the HealthLine has increased in 2013, they are probably still more in the ballpark of the 2012 numbers than the 1988 data (BTW, total system ridership in 1988 was just shy of 70 million vs. 48.2 million in 2012). I am hopeful about the 2013 data, to be released next month.

 

 

Well, when you've got a spokes/hub, downtown-oriented transit system and, then, downtown takes such a devastating hit in terms of jobs and retail, these numbers aren't surprising.  And jobs and retail haven't really improved downtown.  I think some of the growth may be in the growth of downtown as a restaurant entertainment center, more downtown residents and growth in some transit bus/rail hubs, like University Circle and Ohio City.  As someone who's ridden the rails regularly since the late 70s, I can tell you that evening and weekend ridership now kills that of the 70s and 80s when you'd likely see empty trains regularly after hours.  Downtown was a ghost town, and Ohio City was a struggling, run-down retail district with fixer-upper Victorians -- it only saw life on Market Saturday, as it does now (and the Market was the ONLY thing going on aside from the old bookstore on 25th and a few other joints)... Empty nighttime trains out of Terminal Tower was the norm.  You never see that today; even on Sundays.

 

there isn't any reason RTA couldn't redesignt he entire network to work better for the vast majority of people that do not work downtown.

 

http://www.humantransit.org/2012/08/portland-the-grid-is-30-thank-a-planner.html

 

Portland before

 

6a00d83454714d69e2017c318bf81c970b-800wi

 

portland after

 

6a00d83454714d69e2017617825218970c-800wi

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there isn't any reason RTA couldn't redesignt he entire network to work better for the vast majority of people that do not work downtown.

 

http://www.humantransit.org/2012/08/portland-the-grid-is-30-thank-a-planner.html

 

Portland before

 

6a00d83454714d69e2017c318bf81c970b-800wi

 

portland after

 

6a00d83454714d69e2017617825218970c-800wi

 

I've been saying this for awhile.  Welcome to the iconoclasts.    :evil:

 

Seriously, the spoke pattern suits Cleveland even worse than it does Portland, because downtown is on the edge of the region.

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I've been saying this for awhile.  Welcome to the iconoclasts.    :evil:

 

Seriously, the spoke pattern suits Cleveland even worse than it does Portland, because downtown is on the edge of the region.

 

Except everything you see on those two maps is in the city of Portland (except the river island!). I though you were proposing suburb-to-suburb routes?


"Life is 10% what happens to you and 90% how you respond." -- Coach Lou Holtz

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IMO, if RTA were interested in redesigning their system, while a grid would help, even more important would be that RTA should consolidate routes and reduce the number of stops on them so that it can offer greater frequency, faster service, and greater reliability on those routes it keeps.

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While it's not consolidating routes, it is reducing stops to increase speeds, reduce wear/tear on buses and improve fuel efficiency. Of course, a great way to consolidate routes (especially when they share the same street corridor like West 25th or Broadway) is to replace multiple bus routes with a streetcar.


"Life is 10% what happens to you and 90% how you respond." -- Coach Lou Holtz

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I've been saying this for awhile.  Welcome to the iconoclasts.    :evil:

 

Seriously, the spoke pattern suits Cleveland even worse than it does Portland, because downtown is on the edge of the region.

 

Except everything you see on those two maps is in the city of Portland (except the river island!). I though you were proposing suburb-to-suburb routes?

 

Portland isn't as sprawled as the Cleveland area.  So corresponding routes would be suburb to suburb.

 

Since it's a county agency,  this is bad why? 

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^Greater Cleveland is part sprawled, and part compact-- it's like 2 metro areas in 1.  The City is relatively compact and the streetcar/Rapid suburbs including Lakewood, Rocky River and most of the Heights, is pretty compact… The newer (post WWII), like Solon, Brunswick, Parma, Medina and the like, are more sprawled.

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^Beltways around cities tend to encircle a city’s principal commuting area… Note that Cleveland’s “beltway” is smaller than (a generally shorter radius from downtown) than many comparable sized cities, like Cincy, Columbus, Indy, St. Louis and others… Our beltway is more similar to Eastern Cities, like Baltimore and Boston…

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^^ Cleveland actually has a rather low density even in the core. The city is made up of mostly detached wooden framed single family houses. Besides for the small pockets of density in Cleveland Heights and Shaker Heights, Parma actually has a higher density due to smaller houses on smaller lots. Although Cleveland Heights and Shaker Heights are beautiful, they are large houses and decently large lots, lowering the density dramatically.

 

And although Downtown Portland and surrounding neighborhoods have good density, the rest of the city is just average. East of the river matches Lakewood, and density lowers slightly the further out you go. Portland does appear to have a denser region though, and density levels dont seem to drop off as extreme as we have seen further out in the Cleveland Metro.

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Since it's a county agency,  this is bad why?

 

You want your tax-supported transit agency to operate where it can carry the most passengers and thus be an effective user of tax dollars? Putting a high-density transportation mode like transit in the suburbs is like putting me atop Pikes Peak in its thin air and expecting me to carry out my normal physical activities. Neither one is going to last very long.


"Life is 10% what happens to you and 90% how you respond." -- Coach Lou Holtz

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^^ Cleveland actually has a rather low density in my opinion even in the core.

 

Fixed that for you.  Density is a rather subjective quality, and it's getting kind of tiresome to read the same statement repeated over and over like it's a fact and an excuse for why transit or TOD can't succeed in Cleveland.

 

Truth be told, our current density doesn't matter in the sense that it shouldn't hold us back from making transit investments.  We can always tear down and build at higher densities if and when demand is there.  We know development follows infrastructure investment, so we should continue upgrading our transit capacities as we are able to, and encourage future growth in the core.

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^^ Cleveland actually has a rather low density in my opinion even in the core.

 

Fixed that for you.  Density is a rather subjective quality, and it's getting kind of tiresome to read the same statement repeated over and over like it's a fact and an excuse for why transit or TOD can't succeed in Cleveland.

 

Truth be told, our current density doesn't matter in the sense that it shouldn't hold us back from making transit investments.  We can always tear down and build at higher densities if and when demand is there.  We know development follows infrastructure investment, so we should continue upgrading our transit capacities as we are able to, and encourage future growth in the core.

 

I think the statement "Cleveland is low density at its core" is incorrect.  Instead, Cleveland's core seems to be decidedly very dense (10,000 people in about 2 miles).  Also, I agree that development follows infrastructure investments and therefore density can be changed.  This all makes the larger (and correct) case investing in transit is well worth it.

 

However, I don't understand the statement "Density is a rather subjective quality".  What do you mean by this?  Density seems to be a function of [(population/area) = density].  Having a calculation like that would make density a particularly objective attribute.

 

Maybe you mean density is malleable quality?

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<<If RTA were interested in redesigning their system...RTA should consolidate routes and reduce the number of stops on them, so that it can offer greater frequency, faster service, and greater reliability on those routes it keeps.>>

 

We are. There is a press release on this, and it was in the Rider's Digest and e-news. Are you an e-news subscriber yet?

http://www.riderta.com/news/bus-stop-makeover-new-signage-consolidation-existing-stops

 

 

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^And at high ridership stops you'll be posting schedules or at least frequencies by time of day, right? If not real time arrival info (which I'm guessing isn't going to happen).

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^^^^When looking at the most popular urban neighborhoods throughout the world, the population seems to be between 20,000 to over 100,000 people per square mile. 15,000 at the minimum.  Tremont and Ohio City are between 7,000 to 9,000 I believe. Density would be hard to change because nobody is going to tear down the houses. Ohio city more so than Tremont still has a lot of room to grow though so that is good! That's all I meant by being a lower density. It's not low like a Mentor(2000ish) but it is still much lower than core neighborhoods in the largest urban cities. Chicago for instance has neighborhoods over 20,000 and 30,000 people per square mile 10 miles away from downtown!

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DM4 wrote: <<I'm not sure if RTA read this or not...>>

 

As most regulars will tell you, there are two RTA staffers who read this thread religiously (and that does not mean only on Sunday). They are: JMasek, who is a Public Information Officer and Web site content editor, and JetDog, who is the Webmaster. There are 3 things to keep in mind.

 

1. We both have Multiple responsibilities (the cap M is on purpose). I try to check in once a day on this and several other RTA-related threads to answer questions, and set the record straight if inaccuracies exist in the content. I do NOT try to debate opinions, no matter far off they are. Freedom of speech is protected by the First Amendment. I do wish that posters would use the phrase "In my opinion" on posts where it is warranted.

 

2. If a post has real merit, (either pro or con) I will forward it along to the right person. I have no control over actions that are taken or not taken.

 

3. For a specific complaint to be resolved, we need details, as in Friday, March 3, 10 p.m., HL EB on Euclid at E. 105. We have 1,000 bus/rail operators, 400 buses and 100 rail cars. Then describe the complaint. There is a complaint system on the Web site. Please use it.

 

Lastly, no one told JetDog and I to monitor this forum. We do because we think RTA's point of view needs to be here. We'll continue to be here, unless other work, or sick time, keeps us away.

 

I have to go now. I hear some eggnog and fruitcake calling my name.

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Tell that fruitcake to mind his own business!

 

Thanks for being here, Jerry and JeTDoG. I'm glad you both contribute to this forum. It makes it a much more factual and and responsible place to get news and official information.


"Life is 10% what happens to you and 90% how you respond." -- Coach Lou Holtz

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I think the statement "Cleveland is low density at its core" is incorrect.  Instead, Cleveland's core seems to be decidedly very dense (10,000 people in about 2 miles).  Also, I agree that development follows infrastructure investments and therefore density can be changed.  This all makes the larger (and correct) case investing in transit is well worth it.

 

However, I don't understand the statement "Density is a rather subjective quality".  What do you mean by this?  Density seems to be a function of [(population/area) = density].  Having a calculation like that would make density a particularly objective attribute.

 

Maybe you mean density is malleable quality?

 

I know the definition of density,  thanks,  as well as the difference between "objective"  and  "subjective."  What I meant is that forumers  here apparently have different definitions  of what constitutes a "dense"  city or neighborhood,  and blanket statements like "Cleveland is a low-density  city"  therefore don't mean a whole lot because they're subject to individual definitions of high and low density (or  just "density," for short.)

 

I appreciate ClevelandOhio's  reply,  but I think  I've made my point clear and this is veering way off topic,  so my apologies, and I'm sure we can continue this discussion in another thread if you want.

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DM4 wrote: <<I'm not sure if RTA read this or not...>>

 

As most regulars will tell you, there are two RTA staffers who read this thread religiously (and that does not mean only on Sunday). They are: JMasek, who is a Public Information Officer and Web site content editor, and JetDog, who is the Webmaster. There are 3 things to keep in mind.

 

1. We both have Multiple responsibilities (the cap M is on purpose). I try to check in once a day on this and several other RTA-related threads to answer questions, and set the record straight if inaccuracies exist in the content. I do NOT try to debate opinions, no matter far off they are. Freedom of speech is protected by the First Amendment. I do wish that posters would use the phrase "In my opinion" on posts where it is warranted.

 

2. If a post has real merit, (either pro or con) I will forward it along to the right person. I have no control over actions that are taken or not taken.

 

3. For a specific complaint to be resolved, we need details, as in Friday, March 3, 10 p.m., HL EB on Euclid at E. 105. We have 1,000 bus/rail operators, 400 buses and 100 rail cars. Then describe the complaint. There is a complaint system on the Web site. Please use it.

 

Lastly, no one told JetDog and I to monitor this forum. We do because we think RTA's point of view needs to be here. We'll continue to be here, unless other work, or sick time, keeps us away.

 

I have to go now. I hear some eggnog and fruitcake calling my name.

 

I'll vouch for this.  In a previous professional incarnation, I mentioned here (as well as to KJP, if I recall correctly) that the bus stop our employees used was actually several hundred feet away from our driveway, while there seemed to be little or no ridership from the companies closer to it. 

 

Apparently this got investigated and not long afterwards the stop got moved. 

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I brought this up before but KUDOS to RTA for now having the green or blue LED bars on most of the light rail trains now. Something so small makes riding much easier and clearer!

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I think the statement "Cleveland is low density at its core" is incorrect.  Instead, Cleveland's core seems to be decidedly very dense (10,000 people in about 2 miles).  Also, I agree that development follows infrastructure investments and therefore density can be changed.  This all makes the larger (and correct) case investing in transit is well worth it.

 

However, I don't understand the statement "Density is a rather subjective quality".  What do you mean by this?  Density seems to be a function of [(population/area) = density].  Having a calculation like that would make density a particularly objective attribute.

 

Maybe you mean density is malleable quality?

 

I know the definition of density,  thanks,  as well as the difference between "objective"  and  "subjective."  What I meant is that forumers  here apparently have different definitions  of what constitutes a "dense"  city or neighborhood,  and blanket statements like "Cleveland is a low-density  city"  therefore don't mean a whole lot because they're subject to individual definitions of high and low density (or  just "density," for short.)

 

I appreciate ClevelandOhio's  reply,  but I think  I've made my point clear and this is veering way off topic,  so my apologies, and I'm sure we can continue this discussion in another thread if you want.

 

Sorry, I didn't mean to offend - I was just unclear what you meant.

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I can't find information on this on RTA's website... I'm curious with the new and improved New Year's celebration happening downtown if RTA plans on running with extended hours or more buses.  I know several people in my neighborhood hoping to take and return on either the 55 or 26.  With all the extra people and attention on this New Year's celebration on Public Square this year I would hope RTAS would seize the opportunity for additional riders and give them a good experience.  Please don't tell me that RTA plans on cutting back service to holiday hours... ??

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I brought this up before but KUDOS to RTA for now having the green or blue LED bars on most of the light rail trains now. Something so small makes riding much easier and clearer!

 

I haven't seen these yet! Very cool.

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I brought this up before but KUDOS to RTA for now having the green or blue LED bars on most of the light rail trains now. Something so small makes riding much easier and clearer!

 

I haven't seen these yet! Very cool.

 

I noticed these yesterday, and I thought they looked pretty neat. Though, my second thought was, what about people who are color blind? The DC Metro recently revamped all their signage so that lines would be indicated by RD, BL, OR, etc in addition to the actual colors being shown for that exact reason.

 

I also got off at the E. 55th Station to switch lines. It was the first time I had seen it since the new station was completed. I was impressed, and particularly liked the music that was playing at the station. Such a simple thing like playing music can have such a positive effect on an environment.

 

And I was also reminded of my long list of complaints about the system, but nothing that we don't all discuss here regularly (lack of POP on the Shaker lines, no easy transfer between Green/Blue and Red at Tower City, lack of signage on how to actually use the system, substandard fare card machines, people eating on the train and leaving their trash behind, etc).

 

Overall though, I was happy to be back on the Rapid and I was reminded how fortunate we are to have such a rail system, despite its flaws (especially after witnessing the whole Cincy streetcar debacle this month).

 

 

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I noticed these yesterday, and I thought they looked pretty neat. Though, my second thought was, what about people who are color blind? The DC Metro recently revamped all their signage so that lines would be indicated by RD, BL, OR, etc in addition to the actual colors being shown for that exact reason.

 

Yep.  This, plus the lack of an LED digital display in the refurbished Red Line cars shows that RTA may not be very ADA friendly.

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Re: Service on Dec. 31-Jan. 1

 

The Rapid (Red-Blue-Green) will operate from AM on Dec. 31 thru PM on Jan. 1.

 

On Dec. 31: Buses and the Waterfront Line will operate on a normal weekday schedule.

 

On Jan. 1: Buses and the Waterfront Line will operate on a Sunday/holiday schedule.

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I noticed these yesterday, and I thought they looked pretty neat. Though, my second thought was, what about people who are color blind? The DC Metro recently revamped all their signage so that lines would be indicated by RD, BL, OR, etc in addition to the actual colors being shown for that exact reason.

 

Yep.  This, plus the lack of an LED digital display in the refurbished Red Line cars shows that RTA may not be very ADA friendly.

 

You could probably makes the lights distinctive, perhaps a space in the middle for one or the other.

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So what happend to the Red Line today?  Some wire issue caused shuttle busing to be implemented between 98th and 25th.  It didn't seem like that much snow or ice had fallen, but it did cause a nice delay for the morning commute.  I persoanlly thought RTA did a good job communicating the issue, the text alerts seemed to comeout pretty quick and our driver was making announcements to everyone that boarded.  As it was ruch hour she did mention that the 26 would take you downtown from 98th, and there were people at the station providing updates.  The only thing I would mention is that it would be nice to mention any other bus routes that go downtown from the stops prior to 98th.

 

Also, really good to see that everything was back up and running pretty quickly.  That could have caused a major headache tonight.

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