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Cincinnati: Over-the-Rhine: 3CDC Development and News

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Because of the recent road construction which was poorly patched over, the place looks worse right now than it did a month ago

 

this scourge is known as the dreaded "yellow pipe utility cut virus."  It has decimated many streets and shock absorbers...for example, Mitchell between Vine and Reading.  what a hack job. 

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I went on the the Gaterway Quarter portion of the open house yesterday and was just struck that many of the affordable options in Gateway are sold - say $100,000 - $125,000 - but there will not be any units in upcoming phases in this same price range.  As a future first time home buyer, this range is probably where I'd like to be but have I already been priced out of Gateway?  Just an observation.

There is so much more coming that will be in that price range but they are all selling so fast that new supply isn't being built fast enough to replace the solds.  As for the selling of the 300+ units those will move as well.  Looking at just Trideca, that building may be sold out before it is even listed on MLS and the units that are being built now on Main are so jaw dropping that there is already interest.

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There is so much more coming that will be in that price range but they are all selling so fast that new supply isn't being built fast enough to replace the solds. As for the selling of the 300+ units those will move as well. Looking at just Trideca, that building may be sold out before it is even listed on MLS and the units that are being built now on Main are so jaw dropping that there is already interest.

 

I didnt realize they were selling that well.  Everytime I have looked at the listings linked from 3cdc's website it looks like there are a lot of unsold units.  Is there a better website to look at to see what these units are like?

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That is a tough one.  The problem is, many of the units sold do not get to the point of even getting listed and get presold or "sold before sent".  Gateway is averaging a sale a week right now, but have had single days with as many as six contracts.  I really expect for the excitement to really ramp back up when Trinity Flats begins to come out of the ground.  This is another one that probably will be sold off extremely quickly plus Holly and I were just at the kick off for the Pleasant Street portion of Gateway and those too are in the price range that gets snatched up quickly.

 

I tell Holly all the time that the more that do sell the more that will sell.  Gateway is proving itself everyday and is growing stronger and stronger.  But that is just part of it.  When you begin to factor in a completed SCPA, redesigned Washington Park, and more and more businesses signing onto the Commercial portion of Gateway it becomes easier to buy today then it was a year ago but what will it be like a year from now? 

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That is part of it for sure, but not the only part.  My point above was that there are so many things that are being put in place now that each acts as a catalyst for interest and excitement in the Q. There is no more powerful a catalyst then people on the street, residents in the units, businesses in the storefronts...that is the ultimate driving force. 

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I asked Holly to look at some units above MetroNation and she told me they only had one left.  To which I said I just saw like three of them listed online.  She said two had just sold last week and the Q website just hadn't been caught up!

 

I check the MLS (or whatever it is) and there were a number of units on Main and at 12th and Walnut that were in that $100,00 - $150,000 range which does make me feel better for future prospects.

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They need to clean up vine and 12th st NOW...(The actual streets).  Because of the recent road construction which was poorly patched over, the place looks worse right now than it did a month ago.  ...hopefully the streetscape begins sooner rather than later.

 

From my understanding the streetscape project for the Gateway Quarter is planned to begin in July.

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What kind of demo are we talking about?  Is this surgical demolition for a rehab project?

 

The buildings used to go all the way back to the Alley. The first pic is at Mercer and vine.

 

IMG_3780.jpg?t=1214414781

 

 

IMG_3781.jpg?t=1214414870

 

 

 

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They do plan on keeping most of the bricks. They plan to use them on this project, if needed. Also, i love this project it seems like Model is really taking a step in the right direction by moving the rehab up vine. They are almost all the way to Kroger, and there is talk of redoing the other side of the street all the way up to Smitty's. EXCITING!

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Anybody know the name of the project going on along 13th between Vine and Republic?

 

Is that the one on the West side of Vine with the scaffolding covering the front?

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Its to the west of vine.  Using more major streets, it would be in between Race and Vine, more towards Vine.  I haven't noticed scaffolding but will look again.

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Its to the west of vine. Using more major streets, it would be in between Race and Vine, more towards Vine. I haven't noticed scaffolding but will look again.

 

Yeah, I was on Vine yesterday and noticed a building with scaffolding covering the entire front like some major work was about to begin.  West side of the street.  I think it was between 14th and 15th, but I could be a block off either way.  Nice looking (but rundown), 4-story (I think) building.  It was good to see work that far north of the Q. 

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Yea I think connecting everything to that Kroger is absolutely CRUCIAL.    That way, once the grocery store is built on The Banks side, downtown will have grocery stores at the North and South ends.  To me, those are the most important areas.  All is looking good...just hope it keeps going.

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Its to the west of vine. Using more major streets, it would be in between Race and Vine, more towards Vine. I haven't noticed scaffolding but will look again.

 

Yeah, I was on Vine yesterday and noticed a building with scaffolding covering the entire front like some major work was about to begin. West side of the street. I think it was between 14th and 15th, but I could be a block off either way. Nice looking (but rundown), 4-story (I think) building. It was good to see work that far north of the Q.

 

 

Are you sure you didn't see the muralworks scaffolding? 

http://bp1.blogger.com/_-LvpBoDIt4Q/SGhor13Y0uI/AAAAAAAACTI/p_73Z4gUVZc/s1600-h/DSCN4453.jpg

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Its to the west of vine. Using more major streets, it would be in between Race and Vine, more towards Vine. I haven't noticed scaffolding but will look again.

 

Yeah, I was on Vine yesterday and noticed a building with scaffolding covering the entire front like some major work was about to begin. West side of the street. I think it was between 14th and 15th, but I could be a block off either way. Nice looking (but rundown), 4-story (I think) building. It was good to see work that far north of the Q.

 

 

Are you sure you didn't see the muralworks scaffolding?

http://bp1.blogger.com/_-LvpBoDIt4Q/SGhor13Y0uI/AAAAAAAACTI/p_73Z4gUVZc/s1600-h/DSCN4453.jpg

 

No, this was scaffolding that fronted Vine, not the side of a building on Vine.  I saw the muralworks thing that you linked to but the scaffolding was slightly North of that. 

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Here is the information I just received:

 

The developers are very close to a name and it will have 8 units.  Two of them will be 2-bed, 2-bath; two of them will be 1-bed, 1-study,1-bath; and four of them will be 1-bed, 1-bath. The prices will range from 139,000 to 225,000 (these are rough price estimates and could change over time).

 

Here is the sight I'm talking about...

GQ_5_082.jpg

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Its to the west of vine.  Using more major streets, it would be in between Race and Vine, more towards Vine.  I haven't noticed scaffolding but will look again.

 

This work was for trinity flats. they have to retuck a lot of the grout work on that entire building.

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Here is the information I just received:

 

The developers are very close to a name and it will have 8 units.  Two of them will be 2-bed, 2-bath; two of them will be 1-bed, 1-study,1-bath; and four of them will be 1-bed, 1-bath. The prices will range from 139,000 to 225,000 (these are rough price estimates and could change over time).

 

Here is the sight I'm talking about...

GQ_5_082.jpg

 

Any idea which developer it is?  And are we talking about the building up near 14th and 15th on Vine or the one between Vine and Republic on 13th that I had mentioned previously?  (sorry I can't see the photo while at work)

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^I'm talking about the project on 13th Street that you had mentioned.  There are two small structure (one on Republic, and one on 13th) both are part of the same project if I understand correctly.  That is what those figures are for.

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I still feel like until Washington park is somewhat stabalized, you are going to have a hard time selling $300k condos with crackheads and drunks wandering around yelling.

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I still feel like until Washington park is somewhat stabalized, you are going to have a hard time selling $300k condos with crackheads and drunks wandering around yelling.

 

Yeah, it looks really bad for people that aren't familiar with the area especially.

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OTR is huge.  When the hustle & bustle is back in it the way it used to be...it'll be like a whole other city next door to the business district.

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Even if you are, sometimes it is just overwhelming.

 

 

Yea, that uneasy feeling in the pit of your tummy.  Feel ya there!             

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I just back from NYC and some friends of mine that live in Manhattan took me out to an area called the Lower East Side. They were telling me about how dangerous this area used to be and how you wouldn't even park a car down there in fear that it'd be cleaned out by the time you returned. They attributed the "clean-up" to Giuliani.

 

The reason I bring this up is because the area resembles OTR so much that it's scary and aggravating knowing that it can be done and seeing it first hand. According to my friends, the timeline they did this in is also shocking.

 

The area is now overwhelmed with people from their early 20's to late 30's. They are everywhere, including the streets. On some streets you can't even drive because there are so many people that the sidewalks can't sustain the traffic. Shops, bars, cafes, clubs, shops, everything is filling in spaces like they're giving away free lease agreements.

 

For you folks that are interested in OTR's future, you've gotta do yourself a favor and educate yourself on New York's Lower East Side, past, present, and future. Read about decisions made by the city. This is a perfect model for OTR.

 

 

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lower_East_Side

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My feeling is that the mind set of the city of cincinnati is much different than that of nyc.  I would love to see OTR follow this model, but there are just so many people against progress here that its sickening.

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My feeling is that the mind set of the city of cincinnati is much different than that of nyc.  I would love to see OTR follow this model, but there are just so many people against progress here that its sickening.

 

I understand the sentiment about residents pushing back against progress, but I don't think that is the case for OTR.  Have you been down there lately?

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My feeling is that the mind set of the city of cincinnati is much different than that of nyc.  I would love to see OTR follow this model, but there are just so many people against progress here that its sickening.

 

From what I understand, NY cops were even leery of patrolling the LES? What does this tell you?

 

 

Doesn't this shot look like a mirror image of OTR? Taken 2005:

 

280px-OrchardandRivington.JPG

 

 

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My feeling is that the mind set of the city of Cincinnati is much different than that of nyc. I would love to see OTR follow this model, but there are just so many people against progress here that its sickening.

 

I understand the sentiment about residents pushing back against progress, but I don't think that is the case for OTR. Have you been down there lately?

 

I live there and I am totally supportive of the change and also know there are a lot of people that are working for positive change in OTR.  But still, the overwhelming opinion of the general public is not a positive one.  It's the same mind set that plagues other projects around the city (Banks/Streetcars) and is perpetuated by the media.  I believe others have called it a low self esteem problem. 

 

Beyond this, I think there is a significant race problem in this city.  There are quite a few people that don't want OTR to be cleaned up.  In their mind, OTR is where "those people" live and because of that, they could care less.  They all think that their tax dollars are paying for this, and is probably an idea they get from local talk radio.  This is the same crowd who insists that a streetcar will only be used by "Criminals who want to ride down and rob/kill people at the Banks."

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^To be perfectly honest, I don't think it is ultimately up to those constant naysayers whether OTR turns around or not.  It is up to people like you and the many others that live, shop, and hang out in the neighborhood.  It is up to those who want it to be a better place.

 

If those people are around...the developers/investors won't be far behind (like now).  These kinds of things don't happen over night, but give OTR about 5-10 years and you will certainly see big-time changes that previous generations probably never thought possible.

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I still feel like until Washington park is somewhat stabalized, you are going to have a hard time selling $300k condos with crackheads and drunks wandering around yelling.

Consider the project itself and where it is happening.  3CDC went into what was the single worst block in OTR and began redevelopment.  Hard to sell condos at 12th and Vine with shootings, open air drug dealing and the usual day to day thuggery that was synonymous with that block.  Look at today.  Things change and so will Washington Park and it will happen faster than you can imagine.  There is a stranglehold that is being placed on, not just the park, but all of OTR.  Washington Park is being surrounded by development and will be redeveloped itself but look closer at the map that Randy posted, those are just the announced buildings so far and look at the myriad of locations.  No where is being untouched either directly or indirectly by the Q and those 300K units in places like Duveneck and Trideca (which may be sold out before it hits the market officially) are moving, even today. 

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