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Cleveland: Lakefront Development and News

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6 minutes ago, marty15 said:

Can’t they theoretically control the lake level at Niagara Falls/Hydro station?

 

I believe the amount they can divert is minimal.  

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On 9/19/2019 at 11:22 AM, Frmr CLEder said:

When I was a kid, the Aquarama used to cruise from Cleveland to Detroit. Sure would be nice to build a cruise ship terminal to initiate Lake Erie summertime cruises.

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:SsAquarama.jpg

 

I was procrastinating with work today and read up some on the Aquarama.   Also found a Youtube video: 

 

 

 

 

 

Aquarama.jpg

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^^ The Cleveland--Cuyahoga County Port do has a basic cruise ship port that's been up and running for a few years now.  And they are renovating a building for the US Custom -- Border Patrol.  And they have been working to get a agreement with a Canadian Port for about ten years now BUT they haven't been successful yet.  BUT NO FERRY SERVICE YET...

 

The problem is that Toledo actually built a 

cruise ship terminal about ten years ago BUT they was not able to make a success of it.  And so they sold or lease the building to the Great Lakes Museum.   Which by the way I've been to and it's a really nice museum. 

 

It least now we have a growing number of well to do visitors who visit our CITY every summer by cruise ship.

 

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1 hour ago, viscomi said:

^Sounds similar to what happened in Rochester NY

They built a nice one in Erie 15-20 years ago in hopes of it. It might still be empty. Cool looking building. Would love to have it here as our terminal

841BB484-A1B8-4D29-9CE4-32B14979D071.jpeg

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26 minutes ago, Watertiger1962 said:


That is really disappointing. I’m sure the city was tired of no progress. There are many quotes in the article from D Pace. I think the most interesting are the ones about his efforts to partner with or be bought out by the Browns, with no luck. 

 

Hopefully the city already has another partner lined up, otherwise that’s going to continue being dead space for a long time. 

Edited by Boomerang_Brian
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3 hours ago, Boomerang_Brian said:

Hopefully the city already has another partner lined up, otherwise that’s going to continue being dead space for a long time. 

 

They do. Remember I posted here on Dec. 18 that the city was seeking a new development partner? I wasn't able to say much at the time, but now that Michelle has come out with her article, I will come out with mine.

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"Life is 10% what happens to you and 90% how you respond." -- Coach Lou Holtz

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Sigh....but clearly no surprise.  Pace was definitely in over his head as has been regularly noted.  The real screw up was probably the city going with him in the first place.  So another 6 years of planning and promise down the drain.  Really tacky how the city managed the divorce rather than sitting down with him way back when and saying we have problems with how things are going and need to separate.   So we start again from square one.  Hope the Browns really have a plan, resources and partners and are ready to go.

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2 minutes ago, Htsguy said:

Sigh....but clearly no surprise.  Pace was definitely in over his head as has been regularly noted.  The real screw up was probably the city going with him in the first place.  So another 6 years of planning and promise down the drain.  Really tacky how the city managed the divorce rather than sitting down with him way back when and saying we have problems with how things are going and need to separate.   So we start again from square one.  Hope the Browns really have a plan, resources and partners and are ready to go.

 

Browns aren't leading this. They are a partner and they've got resources. They have a voice in the plan but this type of real estate project is not the Haslams' expertise.

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Turns out my information from December -- that K&D would take over the lakefront development -- is no longer correct. I will attempt to find out who the new developer will be.

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On 2/27/2020 at 4:40 PM, Larry1962 said:

 

The problem is that Toledo actually built a cruise ship terminal about ten years ago BUT they was not able to make a success of it.  And so they sold or lease the building to the Great Lakes Museum.   Which by the way I've been to and it's a really nice museum. 

 

 

 

 

booo!   ---  they stole that from vermilion  😡

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Its upsetting how the city just ghosted a developer who really put some skin into the game.  Not returning phone calls is crappy

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One can only assume that someone with a bigger plan and deeper pockets has come along. While a terrible way to end the relationship, it may turn out to be for the best as DP's partnership dissolved and the project was moving along much too slowly.

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To assume there is a better developer with a bigger plan and deeper pockets might be problematic. Just a thought -but does it seem like there is a growing lack of certainty  about where the Browns’ stadium will actually be in the future and isn’t that decision critical to any development moving forward on the lakefront? 

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Reading that article, the city came off so poorly in my eyes. Why would other investors want to come to town and work in this city if that's how they can expect to be treated?

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The City screwed Pace over.  He's a great developer.  The city's administration is a problem.

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6 hours ago, sky said:

The City screwed Pace over.  He's a great developer.  The city's administration is a problem.

I have no trouble blaming city officials and their seemingly never ending blunders.  But Pace, and the snail’s pace (no pun intended) at which he moved this development forward shares some blame.

 

I can’t say I’m shocked the relationship soured, as stated in the article, after five years where we only saw a restaurant and 16 residential units built.

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Pace's first mistake was pairing with Trammel Crow. He thought he had tapped a source of financing but TC was a huge disappointment. Pace didn't have the access to capital on his own so it was only a matter of time before he got thrown off the job if he didn't get another sugar daddy. Yes, the city should have been more upfront with him. But this administration needs to be more upfront and open to everyone. But the city can't use the fairness argument that they treat everyone equally -- all bad. So now developers are converging on City Hall to pick up the pieces and help put this back together again.

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"Life is 10% what happens to you and 90% how you respond." -- Coach Lou Holtz

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8 hours ago, KJP said:

 

Could that be related to the Historic Hulett Iron Ore Unloaders?

 

That looks like the location where there WAS a plan to partially install one of the Huletts as part of D*ck Pace's project for the lakefront...

Edited by Larry1962
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"Life is 10% what happens to you and 90% how you respond." -- Coach Lou Holtz

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6 hours ago, Larry1962 said:

Could that be related to the Historic Hulett Iron Ore Unloaders?

 

That looks like the location where there WAS a plan to partially install one of the Huletts as part of D*ck Pace's project for the lakefront...

 

@Larry1962 A reply from the North Coast Harbor Twitter account....

 

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"Life is 10% what happens to you and 90% how you respond." -- Coach Lou Holtz

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9 hours ago, KJP said:

 

 

It's always nice to see efforts to encourage regionalism and doing so within NOACA's territory makes sense given they control their own destiny, but I cannot help but feel that it falls short if it doesn't aspirationally extend to cooperating with other MPOs, namely AMATS, in long-range visions.

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4 hours ago, Mendo said:

 

People have posted conceptual pics before with the Shoreway converted to a boulevard. The amount of developable land that it would open up is tremendous. Converting it to an at-grade street would be totally worth it, even with the rail lines still there.

 

(From the Cleveland Historic Photos thread)

 

Just imagine how a boulevard would change the experience for pedestrians.  Cyclists.  If we really want to access the lake from downtown, converting the Shoreway to a boulevard should be a high priority.

 

 

 

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6 minutes ago, skiwest said:

Were the conceptual pics posted in this thread or elsewhere?

 

Of removing/downgrading the Shoreway? If so, yes. The diagrams and renderings are everywhere. 

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"Life is 10% what happens to you and 90% how you respond." -- Coach Lou Holtz

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