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Cleveland: Warehouse District: Development and News

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^Don't let reality get in the way of screaming residents, apparently that's all that matters.

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1 hour ago, sky said:

We all want the Warehouse District parking lots to get developed (even if SH doesn't take them).  

I've heard that Cleveland City Council is thinking of doing away with the 15 year residential property tax rebate.  If this happens, we should all assume ZERO new development on downtown surface lots for housing in the foreseeable future.  

Development would come to a screeching halt city wide.

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On 1/7/2020 at 4:47 PM, sky said:

We all want the Warehouse District parking lots to get developed (even if SH doesn't take them).  

I've heard that Cleveland City Council is thinking of doing away with the 15 year residential property tax rebate.  If this happens, we should all assume ZERO new development on downtown surface lots for housing in the foreseeable future.  


I went to their last public meeting about the tax abatement last night - from that group’s consensus, which was mostly people in the warehouse or gateway districts with super expensive condos/homes, it seemed like not many really wanted to totally get rid of the credit, but change it to be more targeted toward the right people (i.e. first time home owners, developers that build affordable housing, and developers that build to sell rather than rent). If we let it go the way it is, I fear that Cleveland will join all other cities in the affordability crisis. Most people under 35 already can’t afford homeownership and can barely afford rent, which is the most sought after demographic, and Cleveland is probably one of the most affordable big cities to live in right now. So that’s saying something.

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21 hours ago, tagalong said:


I went to their last public meeting about the tax abatement last night - from that group’s consensus, which was mostly people in the warehouse or gateway districts with super expensive condos/homes, it seemed like not many really wanted to totally get rid of the credit, but change it to be more targeted toward the right people (i.e. first time home owners, developers that build affordable housing, and developers that build to sell rather than rent). If we let it go the way it is, I fear that Cleveland will join all other cities in the affordability crisis. Most people under 35 already can’t afford homeownership and can barely afford rent, which is the most sought after demographic, and Cleveland is probably one of the most affordable big cities to live in right now. So that’s saying something.

 

These are all fair and good points.  Cleveland remains extremely affordable as compared to most similar sized cities.  I think this debate around the tax abatement and Cleveland becoming overly gentrified and unaffordable is way premature.  Leave it to Cleveland to trip itself up and stall its development.  The Pinnacle condos never happen without the tax abatement on the one hand and on another hand you have very affordable options such as Water Street condos and the Grand Arcade. 

 

I wish Cleveland would just let the market dictate when to curtail abatements and such and stop pandering to micro-protest groups.  The Cleveland market cannot support the current magnitude of development without these incentives.  And from a capitalistic view, why shouldn't Cleveland try to attract high-tax paying citizens?  Why does it generally fall on the urban core to take on affordable housing projects?  Why doesn't anyone tell Orange or Westlake to build affordable housing at Pinecrest or Crocker?  Let Cleveland compete.  NYC/SF/LA have been doing this for decades.  Beating suburbs at their own game.  

 

The answer to gentrification and unaffordability is not to curtail development incentives.  The more development, the more supply of housing.  Let's start by changing the tax code in order to motivate land owners to develop their land, to create more housing supply and less surface parking lot supply.  Without abatements, the Pinnacle condos would still be a crappy parking garage.  What's the problem?  

 

In my opinion, unaffordability is driven by NIMBYs, sprawl and income-inequality.  Supply and demand always rule, so I say fuel the supply as much as possible and let Cleveland do what's best for itself, whatever development that might be. 

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34 minutes ago, NYC Boomerang said:

Cleveland remains extremely affordable as compared to most similar sized cities.  I think this debate around the tax abatement and Cleveland becoming overly gentrified and unaffordable is way premature.

Unfortunately, the cities you refer to (NYC, SFO, LA) do not have 32% poverty rates; they do have problems with homelessness however. That poses a unique challenge for Cleveland, NEO and its residents. The keys may be skill development for newly created jobs and the integration of affordable housing for those lower skilled workers.

Edited by Frmr CLEder
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Let's keep this to discussion of Warehouse District development projects.

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On 7/11/2019 at 2:09 PM, KJP said:

Rockefeller+Bldg-promo.JPG

 

THURSDAY, JULY 11, 2019

Seeds & Sprouts III - Early intel on real estate projects

 

Downtown: Shhh...the Rockefeller Building is for sale

Keep an eye on one of Cleveland's most famous and historic buildings -- the Rockefeller Building, 614 W. Superior Ave. You won't see it listed for sale on any real estate brokerage site or other public listing service. However, numerous spaces are available for lease.

But make no mistake about it, the Rockefeller Building is available for sale. At least a half-dozen potential buyers have toured the building in recent months but there have been no takers yet, according to real estate sources.

 

MORE:

https://neo-trans.blogspot.com/2019/07/seeds-sprouts-iii-early-intel-on-real.html

 Can we assume The Rock will be converted to residential if sold? 

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Weston-Googleaerial.jpg

 

THURSDAY, FEBRUARY 13, 2020

Sherwin-Williams, Stark, Realife & the fate of an historic Superblock survivor

 

Downtown Cleveland's largest parking crater, the so-called "Superblock" where Sherwin-Williams (SHW) plans to build its new headquarters, has a sole survivor among its once vast building stock.

That monolith is set off to one corner of the Superblock, named because its sea of parking is actually spread among two blocks, separated by the one-way alley Frankfort Ave. The surviving building is the former Stark Enterprises headquarters that now belongs to 1350 W6 LLC, an affiliate of Realife Real Estate Group.

And the building may not be long for this world. There are two reasons why the building at 1350 W. 3rd St. is endangered. Ultimately, both reasons are apparently attributable to Realife which bought the building in the final days of 2018.

One is that Realife appears to want to sell the building, possibly to be associated in some way with SHW's HQ. The other reason is that Realife allegedly hasn't been making mortgage payments and may be forced to sell the building at a foreclosure auction.

 

MORE:

https://neo-trans.blogspot.com/2020/02/sherwin-williams-stark-realife-fate-of.html

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"Life is 10% what happens to you and 90% how you respond." -- Coach Lou Holtz

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After our experience with Realife and Yaron Kandelker, I can't say I'm surprised they're defaulted on that mortgage. Certainly brings my 5% odds of seeing that Realife highrise there down to zero.

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6 hours ago, KJP said:

Weston-Googleaerial.jpg

 

THURSDAY, FEBRUARY 13, 2020

Sherwin-Williams, Stark, Realife & the fate of an historic Superblock survivor

 

Downtown Cleveland's largest parking crater, the so-called "Superblock" where Sherwin-Williams (SHW) plans to build its new headquarters, has a sole survivor among its once vast building stock.

That monolith is set off to one corner of the Superblock, named because its sea of parking is actually spread among two blocks, separated by the one-way alley Frankfort Ave. The surviving building is the former Stark Enterprises headquarters that now belongs to 1350 W6 LLC, an affiliate of Realife Real Estate Group.

And the building may not be long for this world. There are two reasons why the building at 1350 W. 3rd St. is endangered. Ultimately, both reasons are apparently attributable to Realife which bought the building in the final days of 2018.

One is that Realife appears to want to sell the building, possibly to be associated in some way with SHW's HQ. The other reason is that Realife allegedly hasn't been making mortgage payments and may be forced to sell the building at a foreclosure auction.

 

MORE:

https://neo-trans.blogspot.com/2020/02/sherwin-williams-stark-realife-fate-of.html

Question...these 55 properties RealLife has purchased throughout Greater Cleveland since 2015.  Are they small flips in inner ring suburban communities that they then rent out?

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7 minutes ago, Htsguy said:

Question...these 55 properties RealLife has purchased throughout Greater Cleveland since 2015.  Are they small flips in inner ring suburban communities that they then rent out?

 

Basically slap a coat of paint on and rent it out. For more information, search his name: http://apps.southeuclidcourt.com/record_search.php

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9 minutes ago, PoshSteve said:

 

Basically slap a coat of paint on and rent it out. For more information, search his name: http://apps.southeuclidcourt.com/record_search.php

Wow.  And those actions are just one city.  I had a funny feeling this was type of operation RealLife was running.  Kinda small potatoes.  Not a company you would think is in a position to build a skyscraper downtown.  Like I posted previously, the company seemed sketchy from the outset.

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4 hours ago, PoshSteve said:

After our experience with Realife and Yaron Kandelker, I can't say I'm surprised they're defaulted on that mortgage. Certainly brings my 5% odds of seeing that Realife highrise there down to zero.

 

Oh it's zero all right. 

 

3 hours ago, Htsguy said:

Wow.  And those actions are just one city.  I had a funny feeling this was type of operation RealLife was running.  Kinda small potatoes.  Not a company you would think is in a position to build a skyscraper downtown.  Like I posted previously, the company seemed sketchy from the outset.

 

Except that they've made $33 million worth of acquisitions more recently. Doesn't mean that they've spent $33 million. But they've acquired $33 million worth of properties since acquiring the 55 properties since 2015. Yaron Kandelker is a front man for some Russian investors who have deep pockets but shallow hearts. I'll leave the rest up to your imaginations.

 

If Stark had to deal with Kandelker, then it was smart of Stark to use a cognovit promissory  note in financing him and retaining significant control over 1350 W. 3rd. A cognovit allows a lender to secure a judgment against a mortgager without giving the mortgager much legal standing to contest it. Kandelker apparently is claiming he has some sort of military affidavit as part of a possible defense.

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"Life is 10% what happens to you and 90% how you respond." -- Coach Lou Holtz

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Of course, this couldn't be in a worse location. I'm curious as to how this little jewel of a parcel will integrate into SW's development plans.

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It probably doesn't make sense to build around it.  That would look odd IMO.

Edited by skiwest
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8 minutes ago, skiwest said:

It probably doesn't make sense to build around it.  That would look odd IMO.

 

image.thumb.png.d1c52942e5dd11129aafff388039bd44.png

 

What I'd envision lol

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2 hours ago, skiwest said:

It probably doesn't make sense to build around it.  That would look odd IMO.

At some point the building will be torn down and that corner will look like the one directly across West 3rd. A small parking lot surrounded by a garage.

Edited by Growth Mindset
Incorrect address

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Would be amazing if whoever gets it decides to restore it to its original grandeur. I’m just dreaming, I know. 

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1 hour ago, skiwest said:

It probably doesn't make sense to build around it.  That would look odd IMO.

 

Its position at the corner makes it easier to adapt to rather than mid-block. It will depend on how much of the original facade remains behind the modern skin. If it has all been removed then there really isn't a reason to keep it. If there is original facade, then restoration of the building which will then inform some of the design decisions of the new construction. 

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16 minutes ago, Old Not Obsolete said:

 

Its position at the corner makes it easier to adapt to rather than mid-block. It will depend on how much of the original facade remains behind the modern skin. If it has all been removed then there really isn't a reason to keep it. If there is original facade, then restoration of the building which will then inform some of the design decisions of the new construction. 

Agreed. Being on the corner, a restored facade could help mesh back the Warehouse District with whatever SHW builds next to it. 

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Have there been any plan/mentions of projects for any of the other 10 parking lots in the Parking Lot Warehouse District other than the 3 that SHW is building on? The SHW project will fill a major hole, but there’s still a lot of lots along W. 9th, as well as the one across from the Justice Center, and the ones between bars on W. 6th. Hopefully SHW will spur future development. The only plans I’ve ever really seen were the Weston/Citymark lots that SHW is taking over now. Maybe I missed something. 

Edited by imjustinjk
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^^From what I've been hearing there are several potential mainly residential projects that MAY REDEVELOP several of the existing parking lots in the Warehouse District.  BUT no signed contracts yet.  Hopefully over the next five years some of them will be built and help satisfy the increasing demand for housing, retail, and office space too.

 

Edited by Larry1962
Typos
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13 hours ago, Larry1962 said:

^^From what I've been hearing there are several potential mainly residential projects that MAY REDEVELOP several of the existing parking lots in the Warehouse District.  BUT no signed contracts yet.  Hopefully over the next five years some of them will be built and help satisfy the increasing demand for housing, retail, and office space too.

 

According to that downtown article a few days ago they HAVE to be condos. I wouldn't mind seeing mid-rise brick condo's here that fit in with the surrounding architecture, I was going to say brownstone style architecture but I would want retail attached. 

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1 hour ago, MyPhoneDead said:

According to that downtown article a few days ago they HAVE to be condos. I wouldn't mind seeing mid-rise brick condo's here that fit in with the surrounding architecture, I was going to say brownstone style architecture but I would want retail attached. 

No thanks, just give me the residential condos. Why are we so obsessed with retail space when time and time again it remains as a vacant store front for years? Tower City is literally a shell of vacant store fronts, same with the Euclid arcade. We don't need more retail space. Just build. 

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7 minutes ago, YABO713 said:

Can anyone share what the building looked like before the facade?

 

Which one @YABO713, the former Stark HQ, currently owned by Realife? If so, it's in my recent article...

https://neo-trans.blogspot.com/2020/02/sherwin-williams-stark-realife-fate-of.html?m=1


"Life is 10% what happens to you and 90% how you respond." -- Coach Lou Holtz

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2 hours ago, AsDustinFoxWouldSay said:

No thanks, just give me the residential condos. Why are we so obsessed with retail space when time and time again it remains as a vacant store front for years? Tower City is literally a shell of vacant store fronts, same with the Euclid arcade. We don't need more retail space. Just build. 


Street level space doesn’t need to be retail. I’m not sure why that’s the trend. It could be space for a small office / business. 

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12 minutes ago, imjustinjk said:


Street level space doesn’t need to be retail. I’m not sure why that’s the trend. It could be space for a small office / business. 

Exactly, there is a ?architecture firm? (idk some business) in the street level space in the Huron apartments downtown.

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Folks (especially for those of you who are newer to the forum), speculative retail discussion will get threads locked in a hot minute. The reason is we've had issues over the years with forumers who would routinely take construction threads way off topic with this - and then our volunteer staff has to take time out of their lives to clean up the threads and bring them back on topic.

We have threads in other sections to discuss retail - the Projects and Construction threads are specifically to discuss the construction process/progress.

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