CincyImages Posted February 22, 2004 Share Posted February 22, 2004 By Greg Paeth | Post staff reporter A plumbing contractor who claims he submitted the low bid on part of the $160 million expansion of the Cincinnati convention center has sued the city, challenging a selection process that he says favors minority-owned companies. Thomas J. Dyer Co., owned by Grote Enterprises, contends that the company that is in line to get the $3 million contract, Nelson Stark Co. of Sycamore Township, manipulated information about minority business participation so that it would meet the city requirements. The lawsuit seeks to prohibit the city from awarding the contract to Nelson Stark, the only other bidder on the plumbing portion of the convention center expansion. Dyer bid $2.96 million for the plumbing contract while Nelson Stark bid $3.3 million, according to court documents. Read full article here: http://news.cincypost.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20050901/NEWS01/509010349 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richNcincy Posted February 22, 2004 Share Posted February 22, 2004 I think giving jobs to minority owned individuals over non-minority individuals if they submit the same bid it stupid. Just put your bid in and whoever wins...gets the job. When the white person becomes the minority....there won't be any affirmative action or minority this minority that...guarantee it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buildingcincinnati Posted February 22, 2004 Share Posted February 22, 2004 :roll: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richNcincy Posted February 22, 2004 Share Posted February 22, 2004 :roll: yeah..i know it's a radical thing to say, but I believe all people are created equally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the pope Posted February 22, 2004 Share Posted February 22, 2004 there's plenty of laws that states and municipalities have in place for the bidding process. some deal with instate contractors, small business, minority, veteran-owned, disable, etc. The weighting of factors, if applicable is usually listed within the Request for Proposal (RFP) Furthermore, you'll see state and local regs that say if an instate contractor is within 10% of the lowest out of state contractor bid, the in state contractor gets it. However, I don't recall any cases dealing with such treatment ever making it very far in court....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhoDey Posted April 27, 2004 Share Posted April 27, 2004 The renderings look alright, not exceptional. I hope it does end up looking like a gaudy monstrossity from I75. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnOSU99 Posted June 25, 2004 Share Posted June 25, 2004 What's the final product supposed to look like again? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Cincinnatus Posted June 25, 2004 Share Posted June 25, 2004 There are a lot of renderings of it here. http://www.cincyusa.com/planners/expansion.asp?sec=mp Here are a couple of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zaceman Posted June 25, 2004 Share Posted June 25, 2004 oh wow, why cant it be taller and more compact??? or most of it glass rather than just one side?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MayDay Posted June 25, 2004 Share Posted June 25, 2004 "why cant it be taller and more compact???" Because the fickle convention industry wants "wide open spaces" aka lots of uninterrupted square footage on one level. "or most of it glass rather than just one side??" Because the fickle convention industry wants control over lighting for exhibit space. *Sorry - I spent a year and a half working for GES, the world's largest trade show contractor. http://www.clevelandskyscrapers.comhttps://www.instagram.com/clevelandskyscrapers/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zaceman Posted June 25, 2004 Share Posted June 25, 2004 oh my thats awful, its a huge sprawling complex. maybe cleveland doesnt need a new one after all lol... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
napier1 Posted June 25, 2004 Share Posted June 25, 2004 cincinnati convention center(Cinergy Center) construction webcam at wcpo.com i had called the convention center yesterday to ask a construction question and when they pick up the phone they already say cinergy center i wonder was that part of the deal that they is to begin using cinergy center now instead of waiting to 2006. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnOSU99 Posted June 25, 2004 Share Posted June 25, 2004 ^ aren't most convention centers that way? They need to be large and sprawly if you want out of town money flowing into your city's coffers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
napier1 Posted June 25, 2004 Share Posted June 25, 2004 why is cleveland having such a hard time getting a convention center off the ground becouse the longer they wait the more harm they do to them selves in my view you see how cincinnati becouse of its expansion and renovation snached to 2008 national black baptist convention(18,000-25,000 people) from cleveland a pittsburgh even tho pitts convention center is already done(2003) and one web site showed a design of the new cleveland convention center and it was spectacular. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zaceman Posted June 25, 2004 Share Posted June 25, 2004 yea but see the only way they can get the money for it is if its a county measure. the soccer moms in strongsville dont like the idea lol but i dunno, id rather see the 30 story world trade center go up heh. And at the parking lot on public square please? http://www.city-journal.org/html/14_2_the_convention.html btw anyone check out this article?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MayDay Posted June 25, 2004 Share Posted June 25, 2004 zaceman, that's an *excellent* article and folks like napier need to read it. I'm not suggesting that Cleveland *doesn't* need to improve it's convention center but in secondary markets the convention industry is NOT growing as much as boosters would have you hope. Cleveland's center is certainly obsolete but gouging taxpayers to foot the bill is not the answer. Plus, it's not enough anymore to have a great facility - now it's completely standard practice for cities to throw in free hotel rooms (by the hundreds) along with a ton of other 'perks' that don't generate profit. Then, each city has to 'up the ante' until they're all slashing their own throats to get a convention that would have nominal economic impact. Conventioneers aren't the most adventurous demographic - they tend to go to the show, eat in the immediate area, and hole up in their rooms. If they get all that for free as part of the city's incentive...? That's how cities "snatch" conventions - they throw in so many freebies that the city ends up losing money in hopes that conventioneers buy enough souvenirs to make up the difference. http://www.clevelandskyscrapers.comhttps://www.instagram.com/clevelandskyscrapers/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
napier1 Posted June 25, 2004 Share Posted June 25, 2004 i read the article and i agree with you Mayday Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richNcincy Posted June 25, 2004 Share Posted June 25, 2004 I want a Queen City Square construction cam!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
napier1 Posted June 25, 2004 Share Posted June 25, 2004 But also Mayday keep in mind that unlike those cities in the article cincinnati isnt building a massive expansion or a huge new center which was the first plan where the center would have been built over the expressway cincinnati is building a expansion that it can actually fill and keep its self competitive with cities its size. For just one example some sports experts say that cincinnati will host a mlb all star game in the next 7 years without a doubt thats what they say but anyway if cincinnati didnt expand its convention center it would not at all be elgible to make a bid becouse the host city has to have at least 175,000sqft of exibit space to have the "mlb all star party" so i think cincinnati is truelly justified for expanding its center unlike some cities. - But Mayday or anybody from cleveland on this forum do you think cleveland will break ground on a new convention center in the next 6 years becouse i think so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
napier1 Posted June 25, 2004 Share Posted June 25, 2004 yeah i agree richncincy wcpo-tv should have put up a queen city square cam too..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zaceman Posted June 26, 2004 Share Posted June 26, 2004 i think its a possibility that cleveland will eventually make a new building. i read some stuff on how they dont have to increase the taxes to build one. i've seen some of the designs and some are more built up than others A sprawling one that goes east of the Erieview complex was one of the proposals http://www.erieviewcenter.com/images/photos/lg/aerial.jpg lol i like how they shined up Erieview Tower lol http://www.erieviewcenter.com/images/photos/lg/erieview_day.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
napier1 Posted July 30, 2004 Share Posted July 30, 2004 They are now starting to put up the steel at the Convention Center so I guess it should be really taking shape here soon......... If you want to take a look for yourself you can just go to wcpo.com........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Cincinnatus Posted September 3, 2004 Share Posted September 3, 2004 I know there's a webcam at wcpo.com, but the picture is tiny and grainy, so here's a recent shot of the current state of construction. They are up to the 4th? floor on the north side of the site. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CincyImages Posted September 3, 2004 Author Share Posted September 3, 2004 Wow I am slow. I didn't even know the WCPO building was destroyed yet. *SLAP* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buildingcincinnati Posted September 3, 2004 Share Posted September 3, 2004 LOL...yeah, they didn't waste any time. They started ripping that down a day or two after 9 switched to the new digs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Cincinnati_Kid Posted May 23, 2005 Share Posted May 23, 2005 A pic from an unusual spot... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Cincinnati_Kid Posted June 23, 2005 Share Posted June 23, 2005 Some pics from today..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cincybearcat Posted June 23, 2005 Share Posted June 23, 2005 Wow, its getting far! I dont really like the big black box, whats up with that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buildingcincinnati Posted June 23, 2005 Share Posted June 23, 2005 "Gimme a C! Gimme an I!" What's that spell? It spells that those same two letters have been up there for weeks! :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SSSCincy Posted June 25, 2005 Share Posted June 25, 2005 That building is heinous. Sad they couldn't have done something better. That is what happens when the cities tries to do modern chic on a shoestring. I hate it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prolix Posted June 25, 2005 Share Posted June 25, 2005 thats the cincinnati way. if they can find a way to half ass a project, they will. and they will do an amazing job at it. just check ot the improvements on our side of the purple people bridge. i mean, newports got nothing on a bunch of yellow home-depot lighting hanging on wires. we rule! maybe the final finish will amaze us all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buildingcincinnati Posted June 25, 2005 Share Posted June 25, 2005 That is what happens when the cities tries to do modern chic on a shoestring. I've been trying to come to terms with how I felt about it, and you phrased it perfectly! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haynesm007 Posted June 26, 2005 Share Posted June 26, 2005 I'm holding out that when the letters are put up it will look much better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CincyImages Posted June 26, 2005 Author Share Posted June 26, 2005 What I think is so horrible about all of this is that the rest of the fascade is stuck in the 1980's. I wish if they were going to do this look that they would do it over the entire building. The Albee Theatre entrance is still remaining which should be placed in a Museum and not stuck on the side of the convention center. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LincolnKennedy Posted June 26, 2005 Share Posted June 26, 2005 While I'm sure it could be more attractive, I am just happy it will soon be built and finally the last of the massive downtown public venues will be complete. They should merge whoever runs the convention center with whoever runs the NKY one on the Covington riverfront, and maybe throw in the Coliseum if that is still publicly owned. Then they need to book those things to full capacity, with whomever they can. In short, get back the cash we put into it and then some. But unlike with the Reds or the Bengals (both of which are simply about civic pride) really make the effort with this thing. I'm skeptical that tax cuts actually increase investment, but there is one place where I think they might, and that is with the hotel tax. Since we aren't going after conventions that are looking at Vegas, NYC, Atlanta, LA or Chicago anyway, we should figure out the real venues we compete with and then say this- "Look, if you go to Pittsburgh (St. Louis, Charlotte, Louisville, Nashville, etc.) your average attendee will be paying this much. Same convention in Cincinnati will only cost the average attendee, this much, which is 20% less. You can do the same things here you can do in any of those cities. So we got a deal?" Any other incentives strike me as being ridiculous, since the point of the convention is to make money for the city through rentals or secondary tax revenue (sales tax, etc.), and call me, pretentious, but bidding on these things doesn't conform with my sense of civic dignity either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prolix Posted June 26, 2005 Share Posted June 26, 2005 What I think is so horrible about all of this is that the rest of the fascade is stuck in the 1980's. I wish if they were going to do this look that they would do it over the entire building. The Albee Theatre entrance is still remaining which should be placed in a Museum and not stuck on the side of the convention center. Yeah, the further they get on this project the more bizarre the entire thing looks. All the renderings and models they showed before this started were monochromatic so we never really saw the contrast between the two designs that much, but now we're all looking at this mesh of 80's pink marble and an attempt at modern chic. Were there any full color renderings shown to the public of this (showing the original + addition?). Or did they just keep it monochromatic in renderings and models so we wouldn't notice or ask questions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SSSCincy Posted June 26, 2005 Share Posted June 26, 2005 We have the worst convention center of any city in the US. WHAT WERE THEY THINKING besides CHEAP! This building is a complete mish mash of design. None of it matches. Who could design something like this. I think the thing should be torn down immediately and they should be made to start over. BIGGEST Architectural disaster in Cincinnati. Somebody's head should roll for this one! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unusualfire Posted June 26, 2005 Share Posted June 26, 2005 give it a chance folks. All of the facets are not in place. Any building looks bad when not complete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buildingcincinnati Posted June 26, 2005 Share Posted June 26, 2005 We have the worst convention center of any city in the US. Okay...now you lost me. I was on board before. I don't think this is the worst in the country! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atlas Posted June 27, 2005 Share Posted June 27, 2005 Yea, I mean my personal opinion is that Columbus's convention center is much, much uglier than Cincy's. But that is just me, I am sure people would disagree! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cincinnatus Posted June 27, 2005 Share Posted June 27, 2005 We have the worst convention center of any city in the US Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moonloop Posted June 27, 2005 Share Posted June 27, 2005 Isn't that a new(green) Home Depot? That is pretty uninspired. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AddisonJM Posted June 27, 2005 Share Posted June 27, 2005 I don't think the building is horrible. The letters, those are horrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CincyImages Posted June 27, 2005 Author Share Posted June 27, 2005 Yea, I mean my personal opinion is that Columbus's convention center is much, much uglier than Cincy's. But that is just me, I am sure people would disagree! Interesting because I love the Columbus Convention Center Exterior. It is funky, colorful and it somehow works in the area surrounding it. If the Columbus Convention Center was built in downtown Cincy I might agree because the fabric of both locations are greatly different but in Columbus where it is located I really like it. Unusualfire, I hope you are right. I HOPE YOU ARE RIGHT! BTW, were is the Bancorp South Center located? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Summit Street Posted June 27, 2005 Share Posted June 27, 2005 the newer part of the columbus CC is pretty neat looking, but the old part is hideous. the bad part of the center now is it takes away a big section of high street and makes it like an empty area. are the letters on here going to spell Cinergy or Cincinnati? (if they are spelling out cincinnati, somebody needs to add a second 't' after they get to cincinnat, hahahahhaha) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CincyImages Posted June 27, 2005 Author Share Posted June 27, 2005 ^ *PUNCH* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buildingcincinnati Posted June 27, 2005 Share Posted June 27, 2005 are the letters on here going to spell Cinergy or Cincinnati? LOL...it's funny you said that because the first thought that came to my mind when I saw that rendering was that the city would probably scrap "Cincinnati" and just put "Cinergy" up instead to save money.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prolix Posted June 28, 2005 Share Posted June 28, 2005 or even better yet, forget the rest of the cladding, just hang some yellow lights over 5th street. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cincinnatus Posted June 29, 2005 Share Posted June 29, 2005 Monte, That is in Tupelo, Miss. It is a city south-east of Memphis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Cincinnati_Kid Posted July 26, 2005 Share Posted July 26, 2005 Here are some pics from today. I think the modern design will really add a much needed splash of POW to this otherwise boring corner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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