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Cleveland's Rapid story told with maps and graphics

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I've expanded the map that I mentioned above.  I added the I-90 West and Southeast / Garfield / Maple CTS Expansions that Ken described earlier in the thread.  I added the Lorain - Cleveland - Solon (- Mantua), Elyria - Cleveland - Lake County, and Cleveland - Akron - Canton (both via Hudson and via Kent) Commuter Rail Lines.  I added Ken's CVSR to downtown Cleveland proposal.  I added the Waterfront Expansion to create a downtown loop through Playhouse Square, CSU, St Vincent's hospital, and Tri-C Metro.  And I added the Dual Hub from downtown to University Circle (to Shaker Square).  (Much thanks to @KJP - he provided the source content and original maps for pretty much every past proposal that I included in this map.)

 

I was hoping the original map would generate at least a bit more discussion.  So I will ask some questions in the hopes of initiating said discussion:

 

- If the 1950s downtown subway loop had been built (as the voters of Cuyahoga county had mandated), does the Dual Hub later become reality?  The Subway Loop would mean that the most expensive part of the Dual Hub was already done, thus bringing the cost for the latter down.

- What impact do you think these projects would have had on their respective neighborhoods, given the realities of suburban flight from the 60s to the 90s? (Let's keep in mind that even cities with much better transportation infrastructure still experienced suburban flight.)

- Is it reasonable to assume that Porter killing the Downtown Subway is the biggest screw up on this list?  Assuming yes, which of these would you consider the next most damaging to have not happened?

 

I also have other related question, but they probably belong in the "Future Expansion" thread so I'm going to put them over there.
 

Anyway, take a look at my map at the link below, let me know your comments, and tell me if there's any other past proposals that I should add.  Also let me know if you have suggestions for working in Google My Maps.  I did learn that the maximum number of layers is 10.

 

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1QdwBIIwzrjApYrytwx8x5gkIHbngBlvr&usp=sharing

 

1019067147_ClevelandRailProposals.thumb.png.6e3184ab37cbc7038fc0b3c0b1acd132.png

 

1196502246_ClevelandRTApastexpansionproposals.thumb.png.ba9133153430758121b75bf82d4fd1e2.png

 

1106511117_RTAexpansion-downtowntoUC.thumb.png.140189a805606cb1ca8dc5062e507ce2.png

 

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The proposed cleveland heights rapid expansion included a detailed land use plan. It was terrible. It called for leveling much of Coventry and the surrounding high density, historic apartment buildings and replacing them with “modern” high rises. You can see an example of it: the musicians tower near Coventry. Had the rapid truly been expanded through cleveland heights, it would be more like the west blvd station (a sea of parking all around) than today’s little Italy station. We are probably lucky it was not built.

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1 minute ago, CbusTransit said:

The proposed cleveland heights rapid expansion included a detailed land use plan. It was terrible. It called for leveling much of Coventry and the surrounding high density, historic apartment buildings and replacing them with “modern” high rises. You can see an example of it: the musicians tower near Coventry. Had the rapid truly been expanded through cleveland heights, it would be more like the west blvd station (a sea of parking all around) than today’s little Italy station. We are probably lucky it was not built.

 

That's a good point.  I keep getting caught up in how great it would be to have Cedar Fairmount and Coventry directly linked to downtown (and UC) via Rapid, but forgetting that ToD was a foreign concept at the time of this particular proposal.

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20 hours ago, CbusTransit said:

The proposed cleveland heights rapid expansion included a detailed land use plan. It was terrible. It called for leveling much of Coventry and the surrounding high density, historic apartment buildings and replacing them with “modern” high rises. You can see an example of it: the musicians tower near Coventry. Had the rapid truly been expanded through cleveland heights, it would be more like the west blvd station (a sea of parking all around) than today’s little Italy station. We are probably lucky it was not built.

I wouldn’t describe the west blvd rapid station being surrounded by a sea of parking, at least due to the station’s existence. There’s minimal parking at this station and the platform itself is below grade and was part of the original Red Line that for the most part doesn’t have a lot of parking, if any at all. Even the end of the original line at w 117th doesn’t have a sea of parking.

Edited by Oxford19

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19 hours ago, CbusTransit said:

The proposed cleveland heights rapid expansion included a detailed land use plan. It was terrible. It called for leveling much of Coventry and the surrounding high density, historic apartment buildings and replacing them with “modern” high rises. You can see an example of it: the musicians tower near Coventry. Had the rapid truly been expanded through cleveland heights, it would be more like the west blvd station (a sea of parking all around) than today’s little Italy station. We are probably lucky it was not built.

Also, sitting here in 2019 with Cleveland, Cleveland Hts and the region with stagnant to decline growth for x # of decades now, these plans from the past may have worked, who knows?  But seeing today’s continued decline and saying past plans that weren’t implemented would have been a disaster is misplaced.

 

now if Cleveland and the region had continued its up to mid 20th century growththen, yes, of course we could look back at these plans in 2019 and say they would have been a disaster and derailed the areas growth if they had been implemented.

Edited by Oxford19

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On 4/28/2019 at 8:47 PM, Boomerang_Brian said:

Hello Urban Ohio.  I stumbled upon this web site a couple months ago and it's my new favorite place on the internet.  Thank you to everyone who contributes!

 

I created a Google Map of proposed rail transit projects in Greater Cleveland that seemed to have had strong support, but were never built.  I started with the existing heavy and light rail plus the HealthLine.  Then I added the downtown subway, the Cleveland Heights Rapid extension, and the Green Line to 271 extension.  My focus was on projects that were "this close" but were killed for a variety of reasons.  As much as I would love to have the Dual Hub, I'm under the impression that it did not have enough support from the right people to make it happen.  By comparison, the downtown subway was a done deal that was only killed because of a corrupt politician.

 

If there were other projects that you think meet this criteria, I'll add them.  Perhaps the I-90 West Side extension from earlier in this thread?

 

Please check it out and let me know you comments.  Hopefully I did everything correctly - this is the first time I've created and shared a Google Map project.  Much of the source material is content that KJP has posted in various threads.  My contribution is putting into the Google Maps platform.

 

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1QdwBIIwzrjApYrytwx8x5gkIHbngBlvr&usp=sharing

 

179865192_RTA-pastexpansionproposals.thumb.png.22e9b913dafe6697e0dedb572ecf5eb9.png

 

1901457959_ClevelandDowntownSubway-1953Proposal.thumb.png.87d2616b642c7504cfc9a3850b1c55de.png

 

 

This is great - an interesting next version could be an overlay of existing lines to get a sense of the gaps. Great job! Also, KJP continues to prove himself a trove of information. The historical documents up the thread are really interesting.

 

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34 minutes ago, ASP1984 said:

 

 

This is great - an interesting next version could be an overlay of existing lines to get a sense of the gaps. Great job! Also, KJP continues to prove himself a trove of information. The historical documents up the thread are really interesting.

 

 

The existing lines are there. Did you open the link or just look at the screen captures in my post? The Google Map tool is very interesting - you can turn individual layers on and off for better visibility. And I’ve added quite a few more lines since that first post. I’m thinking about adding the 2012 Blue Line extension proposals next.  

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5 minutes ago, Boomerang_Brian said:

 

The existing lines are there. Did you open the link or just look at the screen captures in my post? The Google Map tool is very interesting - you can turn individual layers on and off for better visibility. And I’ve added quite a few more lines since that first post. I’m thinking about adding the 2012 Blue Line extension proposals next.  

 

Ahh nice! Admittedly I'm at work (as typical when perusing Urban Ohio haha) and didn't have the time to get fully into it, but looking forward to taking a look with more time! It will be fun to track developments all over town w/r/t your map - thanks for putting it together!

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