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Cleveland: Downtown: The Avenue District

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I think the developer is very motivated to see those additional phases move forward as planned too!  This economic stall hit everyone in a very disconcerning way, but it has to end at some point.  The development and timelines for those phases are as much a function of the lending community's willingness to fund urban projects again as much as it is buyers willingness to invest their money in to the heart of their City. 

 

Believe it or not, last month was the best month in terms of traffic through the sales center if 3 years.  There is still a very interested audience in living downtown. 

 

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I think the developer is very motivated to see those additional phases move forward as planned too!  This economic stall hit everyone in a very disconcerning way, but it has to end at some point.  The development and timelines for those phases are as much a function of the lending community's willingness to fund urban projects again as much as it is buyers willingness to invest their money in to the heart of their City. 

 

Believe it or not, last month was the best month in terms of traffic through the sales center if 3 years.  There is still a very interested audience in living downtown. 

 

That is great news, I recently heard similar news from a developer of another for sale project downtown.

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I think the developer is very motivated to see those additional phases move forward as planned too! This economic stall hit everyone in a very disconcerning way, but it has to end at some point. The development and timelines for those phases are as much a function of the lending community's willingness to fund urban projects again as much as it is buyers willingness to invest their money in to the heart of their City.

 

Believe it or not, last month was the best month in terms of traffic through the sales center if 3 years. There is still a very interested audience in living downtown.

 

That is great news, I recently heard similar news from a developer of another for sale project downtown.

 

Hooray more potential new neighbors!!!!!!

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I think the developer is very motivated to see those additional phases move forward as planned too!  This economic stall hit everyone in a very disconcerning way, but it has to end at some point.  The development and timelines for those phases are as much a function of the lending community's willingness to fund urban projects again as much as it is buyers willingness to invest their money in to the heart of their City. 

 

Believe it or not, last month was the best month in terms of traffic through the sales center if 3 years.  There is still a very interested audience in living downtown. 

 

That is great news, I recently heard similar news from a developer of another for sale project downtown.

 

Hooray more potential new neighbors!!!!!!

 

That means a lot more muffins for you to bake to put into your "welcome neighbor" baskets.

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I think the developer is very motivated to see those additional phases move forward as planned too! This economic stall hit everyone in a very disconcerning way, but it has to end at some point. The development and timelines for those phases are as much a function of the lending community's willingness to fund urban projects again as much as it is buyers willingness to invest their money in to the heart of their City.

 

Believe it or not, last month was the best month in terms of traffic through the sales center if 3 years. There is still a very interested audience in living downtown.

 

That is great news, I recently heard similar news from a developer of another for sale project downtown.

 

Hooray more potential new neighbors!!!!!!

 

That means a lot more muffins for you to bake to put into your "welcome neighbor" baskets.

 

Hahaha.  Believe it or not, I currently don't do such things!

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I think the developer is very motivated to see those additional phases move forward as planned too!  This economic stall hit everyone in a very disconcerning way, but it has to end at some point.  The development and timelines for those phases are as much a function of the lending community's willingness to fund urban projects again as much as it is buyers willingness to invest their money in to the heart of their City. 

 

Believe it or not, last month was the best month in terms of traffic through the sales center if 3 years.  There is still a very interested audience in living downtown. 

 

That is great news, I recently heard similar news from a developer of another for sale project downtown.

 

Hooray more potential new neighbors!!!!!!

 

That means a lot more muffins for you to bake to put into your "welcome neighbor" baskets.

 

Hahaha.  Believe it or not, I currently don't do such things!

 

You're letting that brand new kitchen go to waste??  The shame!

yenta2.jpg

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Punch - All of the above!  Our buyers range from young professional couples to active adults (aging boomers) who's last kid just left/is leaving for college.  It's exactly those demographics that you read about in industry mags or university-sponsored reports.  The interesting thing about our buyers is their level of involvement in the community and development.  Every resident has taken ownership, not just of their property of of the development and the eastern edge of downtown.  From getting rid of the debris pile at the Tech Center to pushing for more green space, to recommending friends for new sales, the residents are as involved as the developer. 

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MTS - fair enough.  Why don't you stop by and help make those bathrooms better!!!!!  We're always open to suggestions and new ideas.  PM me and set some time for a tour. 

 

In fact, we should have a U.O. "happy hour" at The Avenue District!  Who's in? 

 

This is actually a clip from a City of Cleveland sponsored program airing on Ch. 20 (City of Cleveland public access) that highlights new construction and other housing opportunities. 

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MTS - fair enough.  Why don't you stop by and help make those bathrooms better!!!!!  We're always open to suggestions and new ideas.  PM me and set some time for a tour. 

 

Pay me.  Dead serious.

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Those bathrooms and that closet could use some help. Also, the host got the neighborhood wrong.

 

Overall good.

 

I agree.  Where's the stylish tile in the bathrooms or the backsplash/glass tile in the kitchen.  We took a look at these last time we were in town but.... 

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Good to hear enough is done so that it is resident-ready. As for the bikes, they are vehicles and there should be sharrows so that cyclists are riding in the most predictable manner among drivers in 1,000+ lbs of metal. That would be like a car so as to avoid ending up in a blind spot and in an ER room. Cyclist deaths in Portland confirm what I already know about bike lanes, which is that they're more dangerous and are simply car-oriented infrastructure by putting cars first over bikes. There are plenty of lanes for cars to pass cyclists here. Also, I'm sure some of you guys noticed, but I see that UO is linked there.

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I'm up for a UO happy hour! Be sure to offer non-alcoholic beverages, please.

 

 

 

Those bathrooms and that closet could use some help. Also, the host got the neighborhood wrong.

 

Overall good.

 

As a straight man, I didn't see anything wrong with them!!  :-P  Just throw your dirty clothes on the floor and use the bathroom counter for storing leftover food, cans of WD40, Drano and dirty rags.  :-o

 

Seriously, these are for-sale units. If you don't like a design feature, you can always change it.


"Life is 10% what happens to you and 90% how you respond." -- Coach Lou Holtz

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Im just pickin...  They are some of the nicer new construction in Cleveland I guess, but they are also pretty pricey for Cleveland, with some seemingly pretty standard features.  And the fee's (a trade off for the tax abatement I guess)....  I want a house with a yard for poochy and garden for me.  :-D

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Im just pickin... They are some of the nicer new construction in Cleveland I guess, but they are also pretty pricey for Cleveland, with some seemingly pretty standard features. And the fee's (a trade off for the tax abatement I guess).... I want a house with a yard for poochy and garden for me. :-D

 

They're so expensive cause the building was constructed with post-tensioned concrete instead of steel.....  We didn't even consider the condo building because we were priced out of everything but the 900 sq ft 1 bdrm/1bath with a single parking spot.

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I'm up for a UO happy hour! Be sure to offer non-alcoholic beverages, please.

 

 

 

Those bathrooms and that closet could use some help. Also, the host got the neighborhood wrong.

 

Overall good.

 

As a straight man, I didn't see anything wrong with them!!  :P  Just throw your dirty clothes on the floor and use the bathroom counter for storing leftover food, cans of WD40, Drano and dirty rags.  :o

 

Seriously, these are for-sale units. If you don't like a design feature, you can always change it.

 

At that price point, I should have a menu of features to chose from.  That was a below standard bathroom counter. The closet should have a built in closet system included at that price point.

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Thanks for the feedback.  This stuff is very helpful!  The video didn't do a good job of conveying that there really is a menu of options to choose from for finishes.  It just so happened that they decided to shoot the video in a sold unit, and the buyer selected those finishes. Buyers in the loft building can pretty much get their pick of the litter in terms of cabinets, counter tops, flooring, etc.  Even walls can be moved (and in some units they have!!!) 

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Thanks for the feedback.  This stuff is very helpful!  The video didn't do a good job of conveying that there really is a menu of options to choose from for finishes.  It just so happened that they decided to shoot the video in a sold unit, and the buyer selected those finishes. Buyers in the loft building can pretty much get their pick of the litter in terms of cabinets, counter tops, flooring, etc.  Even walls can be moved (and in some units they have!!!) 

 

Thats what you should focus on.  The video should have been shot from the Kitchen with the view in the background.

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I drove by the condo portion of the Avenue District yesterday for the first time in a long time and was disappointed (although quite frankly not surprised) to see that a significant portion of the block has reverted back to surface parking.  I cannot blame Zaremba for wanting to make some money rather than letting the land just sit there, but it left me with a bad taste in my mouth.  That block has been surfacing parking for 25-30 years and I had high hopes that that was gone for good.  Unfortunately (and not to be a negative nelly), I have a feeling the remainder of the block will stay surface parking for quite some time to come.

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I drove by the condo portion of the Avenue District yesterday for the first time in a long time and was disappointed (although quite frankly not surprised) to see that a significant portion of the block has reverted back to surface parking. I cannot blame Zaremba for wanting to make some money rather than letting the land just sit there, but it left me with a bad taste in my mouth. That block has been surfacing parking for 25-30 years and I had high hopes that that was gone for good. Unfortunately (and not to be a negative nelly), I have a feeling the remainder of the block will stay surface parking for quite some time to come.

 

Until the next building goes up, yes.  Same with the townhomes :(  I'm not into legal stuff, but how much of that land does the city still own with Zaremba having a land option on it?  That I'm not sure of.

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I drove by the condo portion of the Avenue District yesterday for the first time in a long time and was disappointed (although quite frankly not surprised) to see that a significant portion of the block has reverted back to surface parking. I cannot blame Zaremba for wanting to make some money rather than letting the land just sit there, but it left me with a bad taste in my mouth. That block has been surfacing parking for 25-30 years and I had high hopes that that was gone for good. Unfortunately (and not to be a negative nelly), I have a feeling the remainder of the block will stay surface parking for quite some time to come.

 

Until the next building goes up, yes. Same with the townhomes :( I'm not into legal stuff, but how much of that land does the city still own with Zaremba having a land option on it? That I'm not sure of.

 

Any inkling of WHEN contruction will start on the next building.  I realize they have to sell a certain number of units in the first building to move on to the next... how close are they?  5 units? 10? 30?  I guess I am frustrated because, IMO, Zaremba built 1/3 of a building that outwardly looks incomplete.  With that said, I don't totally blame Zaremba for the situation given the lending freeze.

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I drove by the condo portion of the Avenue District yesterday for the first time in a long time and was disappointed (although quite frankly not surprised) to see that a significant portion of the block has reverted back to surface parking.  I cannot blame Zaremba for wanting to make some money rather than letting the land just sit there, but it left me with a bad taste in my mouth.  That block has been surfacing parking for 25-30 years and I had high hopes that that was gone for good.  Unfortunately (and not to be a negative nelly), I have a feeling the remainder of the block will stay surface parking for quite some time to come.

 

Until the next building goes up, yes.  Same with the townhomes :(  I'm not into legal stuff, but how much of that land does the city still own with Zaremba having a land option on it?  That I'm not sure of.

 

Any inkling of WHEN contruction will start on the next building.  I realize they have to sell a certain number of units in the first building to move on to the next... how close are they?  5 units? 10? 30?  I guess I am frustrated because, IMO, Zaremba built 1/3 of a building that outwardly looks incomplete.  With that said, I don't totally blame Zaremba for the situation given the lending freeze.

 

Not only do they need to finish (or come close to) selling the first building, but they also need to pre-sell units for a second building.  So as of right now, there is no inkling.

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^and it's not just the "credit crunch"... it's the way that banks are unfairly (imho) focussing a lot of their "wrath" on condo buyers.  It's incredibly hard to get a loan for a condo tower unit right now even if you want to buy.

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Any inkling of WHEN contruction will start on the next building. I realize they have to sell a certain number of units in the first building to move on to the next... how close are they? 5 units? 10? 30? I guess I am frustrated because, IMO, Zaremba built 1/3 of a building that outwardly looks incomplete. With that said, I don't totally blame Zaremba for the situation given the lending freeze.

 

Anyone have info on this? Would really be intresting to see.

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This cant be good:

 

Panzica Construction sues Zaremba Inc. to collect on bill for condo tower work

 

A financial dispute at the 10-story tower at the Avenue District, an upscale housing development in downtown Cleveland, has spawned a lawsuit by Panzica Construction Co. in Cuyahoga County Court of Common Pleas.

 

The general contractor in Mayfield Village seeks to foreclose to collect $2.7 million it says Cleveland-based real estate developer Zaremba Inc. owes ....

 

http://www.crainscleveland.com/article/20100205/FREE/100209868

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This cant be good:

 

 

Unless you're a lawyer!


"Life is 10% what happens to you and 90% how you respond." -- Coach Lou Holtz

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A guess:  they don't see the sales coming, so why wait. 

 

I was so thrilled with the exterior design of this building that it didn't really occur to me how bad the location was for their target market.  Unlike the townhouses, these units were built and priced for suburban empty nesters.  But the immediate area features a concentration of public housing and social service agencies.  The loft building itself is a couple blocks down from a strip club and a bath house. 

 

This package of amenities is unlikely to lure back the very same people who fled the city in their youths... their interests long ago switched from partying to shopping.  Sure they might like fancy dining, but they're on the wrong side of downtown for that, and they've spent their adult lives learning how not to walk anywhere.

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I was wondering how long they'd hold out.....

 

http://www.theavenuedistrict.com/blog/

 

Townhouse Price Reductions

by admin ~ February 2nd, 2010

TOWNHOME PRICE REDUCTIONS:  Units start @ $239,650.  Units w/ Rooftop Decks @ $310k.

 

Pretty sure this is the best deal in downtown Cleveland

 

(Special financing and full 15 years of tax abatement available).

 

The Avenue District Townhomes on E. 14th Streethttp://tinyurl.com/y9quobc

 

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I was wondering how long they'd hold out.....

 

http://www.theavenuedistrict.com/blog/

 

Townhouse Price Reductions

by admin ~ February 2nd, 2010

TOWNHOME PRICE REDUCTIONS: Units start @ $239,650.   Units w/ Rooftop Decks @ $310k.

 

Pretty sure this is the best deal in downtown Cleveland

 

(Special financing and full 15 years of tax abatement available).

 

The Avenue District Townhomes on E. 14th Streethttp://tinyurl.com/y9quobc

 

 

Pretty good deal.  What are the monthly association dues?  Battery Park has some very nice units available also, with 15 yr tax abatements also...

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I was wondering how long they'd hold out.....

 

http://www.theavenuedistrict.com/blog/

 

Townhouse Price Reductions

by admin ~ February 2nd, 2010

TOWNHOME PRICE REDUCTIONS: Units start @ $239,650. Units w/ Rooftop Decks @ $310k.

 

Pretty sure this is the best deal in downtown Cleveland

 

(Special financing and full 15 years of tax abatement available).

 

The Avenue District Townhomes on E. 14th Streethttp://tinyurl.com/y9quobc

 

 

Pretty good deal. What are the monthly association dues? Battery Park has some very nice units available also, with 15 yr tax abatements also...

 

For the townhomes, it's $65/month.  Not bad at all.

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I was so thrilled with the exterior design of this building that it didn't really occur to me how bad the location was for their target market. Unlike the townhouses, these units were built and priced for suburban empty nesters. But the immediate area features a concentration of public housing and social service agencies. The loft building itself is a couple blocks down from a strip club and a bath house.

 

I think it would have been better if the entire neighborhood as Zaremba envisioned it could have been created at once.  One building like that sticks out like a sore thumb.  But if multiple blocks of development had been done at once, shops and restaurants opened, etc, it would have worked.

 

Oh, well.  Money doesn't grow on trees...

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I was so thrilled with the exterior design of this building that it didn't really occur to me how bad the location was for their target market. Unlike the townhouses, these units were built and priced for suburban empty nesters. But the immediate area features a concentration of public housing and social service agencies. The loft building itself is a couple blocks down from a strip club and a bath house.

 

I think it would have been better if the entire neighborhood as Zaremba envisioned it could have been created at once. One building like that sticks out like a sore thumb. But if multiple blocks of development had been done at once, shops and restaurants opened, etc, it would have worked.

 

Oh, well. Money doesn't grow on trees...

 

It has its advantages......  Like there are no drunk people coming out of bars outside my house at 2:30am being loud and obnoxious :-D

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I consider the E. 12th street Streetscape Project to be a part of the AD.  At any rate, it's coming into the homestretch.  Personally I think this is becoming one of the nicest streets in Cleveland.  We need more projects like this and E. 14th.

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http://www.city.cleveland.oh.us/CityofCleveland/Home/PressRelease/prdetail?id=7503

 

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE:

June 29, 2010

TRAFFIC ADVISORY FOR

Wednesday, June 30, 2010

 

Avenue District Phase IV - E. 12th Street Rehabilitation

Traffic shift to begin Wednesday, June 30, 2010

 

CLEVELAND – Construction will begin Wednesday, June 30, 2010 on the pedestrian crosswalk construction for Walnut Avenue adjacent to E.12th Street between Superior Avenue and Chester Avenue. Local traffic access to Walnut Avenue from E. 9th Street will remain open but access to Walnut Avenue from E. 12th Street will be prohibited. E. 12th Street southbound and northbound traffic will remain open and pedestrian traffic will remain open on both sides of E. 12th Street. Pedestrian crossing at Walnut Avenue will be limited due to crosswalk construction.

 

This traffic advisory will remain in place until mid-July 2010. Traffic barrels and signage will be posted. Expect additional notices as work progresses that will impact traffic flow.

 

+ The Avenue District Project is a four phase project to promote redevelopment of the E. 12th and E. 13th Street corridors into a mixed use development. Phase I involved new streets between Rockwell Avenue and Superior Avenue adjacent to E. 13th Street. Phase II involved the reconstruction of E. 12th Street between Lakeside Avenue and St. Clair Avenue. Phase III involved the reconstruction of E. 12th Street between St. Clair Avenue and Superior Avenue and is scheduled for completion this spring.

 

+ Phase IV will construct a new median island and new asphalt paving between Superior Avenue and Chester Avenue. The City of Cleveland is receiving funds from the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act (ARRA) to complete the final phase of the Avenue District.

 

+ This phase of the project, Phase IV, is scheduled for completion by September 2010.

 

-30-


"Life is 10% what happens to you and 90% how you respond." -- Coach Lou Holtz

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Now if only people could get loans for condos......... (or the developer goes for apartments instead... not that they wouldn't do well with apartments being 90% leased downtown).

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From what I have heard (on UO and from people in real estate), the townhouses have done reasonably well but the condos have not.  Keep in mind that the condos weren't exactly flying off the shelf before the credit freeze either, although that certainly hasn't helped.  And it's a shame that the condo building hit the freeze after phase 1 because it really looks nowhere nice as it should.  I just hope it doesn't turn into another AT Tower deal where an unfinished product is left standing alone, because in this case the fact that there are uncompleted phases is readily apparent.

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So I guess the four phases in KJP's post don't refer to the Avenue District itself but the streets going through it.  OK.  But are there any plans to jump start the actual district, i.e. the buildings?  I had thought the "final phase of the Avenue District" would involve filling out the intersection of 12th and St Clair, inlcuding both wings of the existing condo building, as well as the Superior Avenue frontage by the townhomes.  It seems clear enough that a shift toward apartments instead of condos would be prudent... I hope there's some willingness to bend in that direction.  I can't help but think that CSU would be part of the market for this. 

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^I would not be a happy camper if I owned on condo in the tower and the rest of the project was developed as rental units no matter what the market or need.  In fact I could imagine a few lawsuits if that happens.

 

In any event it does not appear that any movement on any phase is likely (perhaps other than townhomes) if the project remains in Zarembas hands.  It has been suggested on this board that they are having financial problems (as a result of the housing crisis I would imagine) as evidenced by their pulling out of Uptown.

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^I would not be a happy camper if I owned on condo in the tower and the rest of the project was developed as rental units no matter what the market or need.  In fact I could imagine a few lawsuits if that happens.

 

Not unlikely, but there's no sense throwing good money after bad.  Is it really preferable to live in an unfinished structure on a half empty block?  Are condos and apartments strictly segregated in other cities?  We're talking about the downtown of a major urban center... having no renters nearby is probably an unreasonable expectation.  If they were promised otherwise, maybe they have a case and maybe they don't.  It's not like this would be changing the character of that building, we're talking about additional buildings.  And I'm guessing the individual sale agreements didn't stipulate restrictions on the entire block.  This isn't exactly a gated cul-de-sac.   

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