Columbus: Easton Developments and News

[Gramarye]

33 minutes ago, cbussoccer said:

I think there is plenty of opportunity to make this a walkable area even with 20-40 story. In one of the articles that came out this past week, they talked about how the parking garages were built to be convertible into residential or office space in the future, or to built up from. Additionally, many of the two story buildings were built to be able to be expanded upwards. Based on that, it seems like a lot of density can be added in the pre-existing core of the area.

 

Now that is really interesting and would change the walkability calculus significantly.  If you could get a residential tower above some of the existing parking garages next to the Town Center, that would be pretty walkable (and drivable as well, since those garages would still offer easy access to and from the surface streets and 270 and 161).

[DevolsDance]

So based on his words, it sounds strikingly like The Domain area in Austin for how this could evolve. The area started out much like Easton and has become kind of a midtown or "second downtown" according to many in Austin. Austin population is similar in size, The Domain is a similar distance from the core, and it's target demographics are extremely similar. 

 

As you can see below, its not the most "walkable" but I imagine we this could easily have been walkable had it been planned more like Wexner is discussing. 

 

 

 

 

The area has also become a hub for a lot of tech in the city as well. My guess is that we're looking as something more like this than specific examples he used.

[cbussoccer]

^ I was just about to post the same thing. I think Easton could turn out to be much more walkable than The Domain, but it sounds like the same general concept. 

[DevolsDance]

8 minutes ago, cbussoccer said:

^ I was just about to post the same thing. I think Easton could turn out to be much more walkable than The Domain, but it sounds like the same general concept. 

 

It's crazy how similar the two are once you really start dissecting it. Now my question is transit, I wonder if Wexner has the political and financial power to connect this "Urban Easton" to the city by more than car or bus. I imagine he does but i'm not sure he would based on how Easton has been built up until now. 

[cbussoccer]

2 minutes ago, DevolsDance said:

 

It's crazy how similar the two are once you really start dissecting it. Now my question is transit, I wonder if Wexner has the political and financial power to connect this "Urban Easton" to the city by more than car or bus. I imagine he does but i'm not sure he would based on how Easton has been built up until now. 

 

If we ever get some sort of rail transportation (which I think we will), I have to think Easton would be somehow included in that whether or not Wexner pushes for it. I also think it would benefit the city greatly to connect both Easton and downtown to the airport. So, at the very least, I think Easton would end up being connected to downtown via the airport. 

[aderwent]

1 hour ago, Gramarye said:

Even if we get multiple 20-40 story buildings at Easton, it's a long way from having a multi-core downtown a la Houston, particularly given that Easton remains right on the suburban border.  That said, it would still be great to have, even without a transit line to downtown.  In addition, while the new development could be more urban in form with mixed use, Easton has covered so much land already that unless they start cannibalizing parking lots to go vertical, even 20-40 residential towers built on the edges of the current development will not really be all that walkable from one side to the other (though if it brought enough density to justify a small circulator bus, that would change things).

 

Remember that the test of walkability is not measured by the walking radius of an unencumbered 30-year-old able-bodied male who bikes 30 miles a week.

 

I wouldn't call it "right on the suburban border" anymore. The northeast area of the metro i.e. Polaris through Westerville to New Albany down to Gahanna has probably gained more than anywhere since 2010; both residents and workers. The 20-40 stories is cool, but I'm more interested in having 45,000 residents in the current footprint vs the 750 there now. That is some really good density @ ~23,000ppsm. As far as "cannibalizing parking lots": "Wexner, Steiner and Flatto also expect changes in what visitors now find at Easton. Flatto sees the surface parking lots that dot Easton as 'just building pads waiting to be built on.'"

[Zyrokai]

I've been to the Domain. It was kinda cool. But for the same reason I dislike Easton, I asked the same question when I was there: "Why isn't this just downtown?"

[aderwent]

4 hours ago, cbussoccer said:

but it's a heck of a lot better than Polaris. 

I wouldn't look past Polaris. They already have The Pointe which is more "urban" than anything Easton has at this point. It also happens to be only the second development in the Polaris area to have a garage; the other being 801 Polaris. Chase's McCoy Center has a few parking decks, though. Anyway, just look at the massive lots around Polaris Fashion Place. They're begging to be infilled with garages and mid-rises circling the mall. The old eastern-most anchor has already been razed for a lifestyle center, and the Sears is on its way to being the same. The layout looks to be much more friendly for large scale developments. Easton may have 22 unique-to-Ohio stores, but Polaris also has large regional draws in Top Golf, IKEA, and Cabela's. Polaris is also located right amidst most of Columbus' highest net worth zip codes.

 

That being said, Polaris is usually a couple years behind Easton. I don't like one more than the other. I think it's incredible to have two areas like this so near to each other in a metro of our size. And one day I think people living in Westerville will have views of two secondary downtowns, and I think that is great for the city. The best part is, both of these are in Columbus city limits so the central city is not missing out on the tax dollars these two upcoming behemoths are bringing in.

[wpcc88]

5 hours ago, DevolsDance said:

So based on his words, it sounds strikingly like The Domain area in Austin for how this could evolve. The area started out much like Easton and has become kind of a midtown or "second downtown" according to many in Austin. Austin population is similar in size, The Domain is a similar distance from the core, and it's target demographics are extremely similar. 

 

As you can see below, its not the most "walkable" but I imagine we this could easily have been walkable had it been planned more like Wexner is discussing. 

 

 

 

 

The area has also become a hub for a lot of tech in the city as well. My guess is that we're looking as something more like this than specific examples he used.

There are areas like this in most southern cities surrounding Easton-esque developments.  They are got the idea from Easton just ran with it, it was only a matter of time before the original caught up.  

 

Also I think it's more likely to happen in Easton versus Polaris because of all the suburban style housing in the Polaris area.  I would not rule out a Crosswoods area from going vertical either, there are a ton of flat lots begging to be redeveloped since it is virtually a commercial wasteland.  A lot of the hotels in the area are also being renovated thankfully.

[jeremyck01]

15 hours ago, MayDay said:

""Wexner likens the next phase of Easton to ... South Coast Plaza in Costa Mesa, California — dense midtown neighborhoods of high-rise office and residential buildings around a shopping core that allows residents and office workers to serve all their needs without getting into a car."

 

Mind you it's been a while since I've been to South Coast Plaza but ehhh....

 

https://www.google.com/maps/@33.6926453,-117.8854492,3a,75y,244.47h,76.31t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sV_BsE2Hnrxfc1kByo8CITw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

 

https://www.google.com/maps/@33.6900858,-117.8810724,3a,75y,358.19h,92.44t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sXymIr_YA6MkdEmS4V76jNw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

 

 

I was at South Coast Plaza a few weeks ago.  As MayDay implies, SCP and the surrounding area are pretty much the opposite of walkable and pedestrian friendly.  It's like playing Frogger.

[ColDayMan]

Easton Named No. 1 Retail Center Experience in America

 

Easton Town Center has been selected by retail industry magazine Chain Store Age as the No. 1 Retail Center Experience in America for 2019.

 

Chain Store Age‘s editors picked the top 10 retail center experiences in the nation from reader nominations. The top 10 reflect shopping experiences that provide superior dining, viewing or congregating experiences to a large number of customers.

 

Yaromir Steiner of Steiner + Associates, which manages Easton, told the magazine “nervousness” is what makes Easton deserve its no. 1 ranking.

 

More below:

https://www.columbusunderground.com/easton-named-no-1-retail-center-experience-in-america-tm1

 

[cbussoccer]

An engineering application has been submitted for a 300 unit apartment building and parking garage, referred to as "Easton Apartments", to be built somewhere on Stelzer Rd.

 

https://portal.columbus.gov/Permits/Cap/CapDetail.aspx?Module=Engineering&TabName=Engineering&capID1=19PCS&capID2=00000&capID3=00201&agencyCode=COLUMBUS&IsToShowInspection=

 

Does anyone have any more info on this? I haven't seen any reporting about it. 

[.justin]

47 minutes ago, cbussoccer said:

An engineering application has been submitted for a 300 unit apartment building and parking garage, referred to as "Easton Apartments", to be built somewhere on Stelzer Rd.

 

https://portal.columbus.gov/Permits/Cap/CapDetail.aspx?Module=Engineering&TabName=Engineering&capID1=19PCS&capID2=00000&capID3=00201&agencyCode=COLUMBUS&IsToShowInspection=

 

Does anyone have any more info on this? I haven't seen any reporting about it. 

 

Putting the parcel number on that application into the auditor's website shows this as being the location:

 

 

 

The application says apartments and parking garage, so that seems to match the expansion's site plan:

 

[cbussoccer]

^ So this would technically be the start of the next phase I guess? I don't recall seeing this included in what was reported to be part of what's currently under construction.

[aderwent]

Publicly traded restaurant company says it's in talks to bring more than 20 new restaurants to Easton

 

"Easton might be teaming up with a New York-based company on what could be dozens of new restaurants.

 

Though no deal is finalized, developers of the Columbus dining and shopping district appear to be talking with New York-based Ark Restaurants Corp., which operates almost 40 restaurants, bars and catering operations around the country, including multiple restaurants and food courts in Las Vegas and Atlantic City casinos.

 

Easton, which was co-developed by Steiner + Associates, The Georgetown Co. and L Brands, would not confirm any conversations with Ark (Nasdaq: ARKR), but Ark CEO Michael Weinstein, on an Aug. 13 call with stock analysts, discussed that possibility.

 

“We made a proposal to them and they’re excited about the proposal,” he said. 'The first stage of it, if it takes place and we think it does take place, would be over the next 18 months to build six restaurants — either our own restaurants or in partnership with other restaurateurs who see the same opportunities we do but don’t have the capability of traveling to Easton ... and would want us to manage it for them or be a joint venture partner.'"

 

https://www.bizjournals.com/columbus/news/2019/08/28/publicly-traded-restaurant-company-says-its.html

Edited August 28, 2019 by aderwent

[ColDayMan]

Project Update: Easton Expansion

 

 

Several key businesses remain on track to open in time for the holidays as work continues on the $500 million Easton Town Center expansion.

 

RH Gallery, Forty Deuce, Forbidden Root, The Beeline and Arhaus are all expected to be open for the holiday shopping season. The spring will see more openings, including Pins Mechanical, True Food Kitchen and Crimson.

 

The 136-room Aloft Hotel is further behind in its construction schedule, but is still expected to open some time in 2020.

 

More below:

https://www.columbusunderground.com/project-update-easton-expansion-bw1

 

[cbussoccer]

A new structure application was filed a few days ago for a "5 story type 3A construction building sitting atop a 2 story type 1A construction building". I'm assuming this means 5 stories of residential atop two stories of parking. Based on how Easton has been developed, I would assume (and hope) that at least the portion along Worth would include ground floor retail.

 

 

This application is related this parcel which was discussed a few posts ago:

 

 

A 7-story structure would make sense considering the below picture from the CU article posted above.  

 

[NorthShore647]

Easton Expansion Progress Pictures (weekend of Dec. 6th):

 

View from the corner of Worth Ave and Fenlon. Expanded Parking garage north of the Macy's. From looking at the site plans I believe the only street level retail within the garage will be at this corner. 

 

From a similar view, the original parking structure which has since been added to. 

https://www.google.com/maps/@40.0543381,-82.9141544,3a,75y,119.88h,84.49t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sJY1DU77bQSdT_WLYeQ6Ntg!2e0!5s20171001T000000!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en

 

View to the North from the same corner, looking east down Worth Ave. 

 

The same updated/expanded Macy's garage further east down Worth Ave. 

 

True Food Kitchen and Crimson Cup buildings north of the garage. 

 

 

Across "The Yard" is the Forbidden Root Brewpub which opened in late November. It seems most other tenants won't open til spring. The block will also include the Forty Deuce Cafe and Speakeasy along with The Beeline Bar. 

 

The next block on the North side of Worth Ave is the Restoration Hardware building. From Easton: 

 

"The first RH design gallery of its kind in the state of Ohio and one of only 19 in the country, this acclaimed lifestyle destination will be a striking three-story, 40,000- square-foot freestanding building. It will offer an inspiring and expansive collection of home furnishings in a gallery setting, an interactive RH Design Atelier with professional design services, and a Rooftop Park and Café." https://eastontowncenter.com/easton-expansion

 

Said rooftop restaurant opens Dec. 12th. https://www.columbusalive.com/foodanddining/20191211/food-news-restoration-hardwares-rooftop-restaurant-opens-at-easton

 

Next door to Restoration Hardware is a free standing Arhaus. The view across Worth Ave from it is of the new Aloft Hotel still early in construction. The white building to the left will house offices above a retail/restaurant space, and serves as the front of a large new parking deck which stretches south to Alston St. 

 

 

The sky-bridge above connects the parking garage to an additional office building at the corner of Worth and Stelzer. According to site plans there should be a retail/restaurant space on the first level, but it doesn't appear to connect to the sidewalk along Worth. 

 

The Worth Stelzer intersection, with Easton Gateway in the background. The building application mentioned in the post above is for this dirt lot in the left of the picture below. 

 

The last building in the expansion is just east of the expanded Macy's parking garage at the corner of Worth Ave and Brighton Rose Way. The office building will have a Pins Mechanical Company bar on its first floor. 

 

Another view from the east. 

 

 

 

[ColDayMan]

Well, Easton told Dublin to "Hold my beer!" on that one.

[NorthShore647]

Easton is definitely moving in the right direction with this project, adding more entertainment and "lifestyle" tenants with office space above. It grows towards connecting the town center to the next most walkable development, Easton Gateway across Stelzer.

 

In my personal opinion tough, they kind of miss the mark on this expansion.  Although I caught the project before its complete (with only a couple of businesses open), most of the buildings and streetscape were finished. One of my biggest gripes is that they kept the surface lot at the southwest corner of Fenlon and Worth Ave. It's only ~70 spots, and its not like there is a shortage of free and close parking tucked into every corner of Easton. Its small, but along with the Nordstrom's loading dock across the street, it forms a bit of a barrier between phases. It doesn't even need to be another building, just not a surface lot. 

 

Another questionable decision is the lack of retail in the newly expanded Macy's garage that makes up a decent portion of the walk along Worth in the new expansion. It really takes away from the feel or aesthetic I think they are trying to go for. Its not just that its parking at street level, but that its a big, empty hole in the building facade. It isn't finished yet, but it also didn't look like there would be any thing put in these ~12 foot tall gaps (at least for now).  

 

On the other end of the expansion, Easton Gateway seems quite far and still disconnected. They'll need to build up on the current Sleep Number and J/ Alexander's Buildings or overcome the barrier of Stelzer in some way if they want to actually form a connective fabric. A 90 ft crosswalk on a 40 mph road is not welcoming to most pedestrians. Some of these qualms of mine could however be relatively easily addressed, and will hopefully come once Easton becomes more of a true mixed use, dense node in the region. If they don't work on this kind of stuff or de-emphasize vehicles in some way, it won't reach its full potential. 

 

TL;DR - Easton is moving in the right direction with this expansion, but they'll still need to work on "connecting" Town Center, the new Expansion and eventually Easton Gateway. 

Edited December 12, 2019 by NorthShore647

[cbussoccer]

7 hours ago, NorthShore647 said:

TL;DR - Easton is moving in the right direction with this expansion, but they'll still need to work on "connecting" Town Center, the new Expansion and eventually Easton Gateway. 

Just remember, they are from from finished with there expansion. Based on the info we’ve been given so far, there is A LOT more to come. 

[wpcc88]

2 hours ago, cbussoccer said:

Just remember, they are from from finished with there expansion. Based on the info we’ve been given so far, there is A LOT more to come. 

When is the old Shriners lot going to finally be used? They shut that thing down when gateway was built and still haven’t heard anything about its future. If there was news it’s been so long that I’ve forgotten all about it.

[DTCL11]

Meh. I find very little about this Exciting or 'in the right direction.' They're still largely neglecting residences. One potential building is still less than even Polaris has built in the Last few years. It's hardly a 'hold my beer's to Bridge Park as Bridge park's goal of residency has been ever present and a major part of the build out. Easton's Vague implications of more down the road while only building out retail is the general MO for the last 20 years. When they get serious about adding significant residential and perhaps a mid-rise or five, then it might be exciting. It was Feb of 2017 when Easton got the big tax deal with Linden and announced a 10 year abatement on over 1million SF of residential that has yet to appear. That doesn't kick in until its built and there appears to be no deadline so Easton seems to have gotten a tax break to cash in whenever, if they ever follow through with it. 

 

Until then, it's just a variant on a shopping mall. Albeit a successful one from that standpoint, but I'm still hesitant to celebrate anything regarding urban density about it.  

 

Tear down the out lots, including across Morse Road, front the retail on Morse and build 10,000 residences across the whole area, THEN they might be onto something game changing for urbanism. 

[cbussoccer]

16 minutes ago, DTCL11 said:

Tear down the out lots, including across Morse Road, front the retail on Morse and build 10,000 residences across the whole area, THEN they might be onto something game changing for urbanism. 

 

So you won't be happy with Easton until they build 10,000 residential units? lol

 

Nobody here is claiming that Easton is doing anything "game changing for urbanism". 

 

 

 

 

[DTCL11]

1 hour ago, cbussoccer said:

 

So you won't be happy with Easton until they build 10,000 residential units? lol

 

Nobody here is claiming that Easton is doing anything "game changing for urbanism". 

 

That's a fair assessment and a legit sentiment I have. Heck, Easton could probably accommodate 20,000 units if done correctly and become it's own city. Easton should be pushed to be more than it is.  We shouldn't only be concerned when downtown and downtown adjacent developments don't realize full potential, Easton should face just as much scrutiny IMO and not treated as an 'oh well, it's a suburban mall' mentality. It can still contribute to the health of the city in more ways than it does. They should have never been permitted to build Easton Gateway the way they did. The city needs housing. Easton has the Land. It can get the capital. It has the draw. It has the infrastructure. It has the potential to be a bridge park x20. To be like developments seen in Texas (mentioned above). Even better if they are able to achieve true mixed income residential. But the focus is clear, maximize profit on retail and maybe consider some residential aspects while promising residential to obtain financial benefits from the city and the city is willing to let them do pretty much whatever they want. It really does say something when Polaris is venturing more into residential focus than Easton. 

Edited December 12, 2019 by DTCL11

[GCrites]

The mind will indeed get bored between stores if it has to look at a bunch of crossover SUVs rather than stores for long stretches. I'm confident that the people involved know this.

[Toddguy]

23 hours ago, DTCL11 said:

 

That's a fair assessment and a legit sentiment I have. Heck, Easton could probably accommodate 20,000 units if done correctly and become it's own city. Easton should be pushed to be more than it is.  We shouldn't only be concerned when downtown and downtown adjacent developments don't realize full potential, Easton should face just as much scrutiny IMO and not treated as an 'oh well, it's a suburban mall' mentality. It can still contribute to the health of the city in more ways than it does. They should have never been permitted to build Easton Gateway the way they did. The city needs housing. Easton has the Land. It can get the capital. It has the draw. It has the infrastructure. It has the potential to be a bridge park x20. To be like developments seen in Texas (mentioned above). Even better if they are able to achieve true mixed income residential. But the focus is clear, maximize profit on retail and maybe consider some residential aspects while promising residential to obtain financial benefits from the city and the city is willing to let them do pretty much whatever they want. It really does say something when Polaris is venturing more into residential focus than Easton. 

I really do not understand why they are not building tons of residential. Could it be that they are afraid that if they build a ton of rental units, that at some point in time they might become occupied by(What Easton might consider)"undesirable elements" that could have negative consequences for Easton as a whole? I just do not get why they are not building dense housing close to/as part of an area that is a destination place like Easton is. And I agree it really has the potential to become a huge node in a multi-nodal Columbus and also the potential to be a focus of any kind of light rail(to connect it to other nodes like the CBD and the airport.)

 

If you could get 20,000 housing units with 30,000 to 40,000 residents in a few square miles you could really have a dense enough population cluster to make light rail to say the airport and downtown really work both ways-residents commuting downtown and downtown residents commuting to lots of retail, etc. That connection would make it much easier to be carless in the CBD(along with improved mass transit busses or streetcars)in the downtown area itself-maybe more of the Cbus type cirulators and such.

Edited December 13, 2019 by Toddguy

[cbussoccer]

You guys seem to be totally ignoring the articles that came out this past summer which talked pretty extensively about Easton's future. 

 

https://gatehousenews.com/eastonanniversary/latest-easton-expansion-focuses-on-an-edgy-urban-vibe/site/dispatch.com/

Quote

 

After 4 million square feet of retail and entertainment space, Easton is ready to go big.

Its developers envision a dense town, with apartments, offices and high-rises, emerging around the Easton Town Center shopping and entertainment district.

"The next round of development will be 20- or 40-story buildings, a combination of office and residential, condos, or complete mixed-use buildings with a hotel, residential and commercial," said Leslie H. Wexner, founder of Easton and chairman of L Brands.

"The biggest shift is Easton will become denser and more vertical. We see it as more of an urban neighborhood, not a suburban shopping center."

About 200 of Easton's 1,300 acres have yet to be developed, allowing for a lot of change. (Easton Town Center now covers about 90 acres.)

 

 

And then there's this:

Quote

 

Steiner sees "thousands" of new residences in Easton's future, many of them filled with the 30,000 people who work in Easton's offices.

"We want to detach ourselves from a commercial district," said Steiner, chief executive officer of Steiner + Associates. "We want to become a neighborhood."

 

 

The expansion that's currently under construction is just a tiny sliver of what's to come. Easton management know they must incorporate much more residential space and they are preparing to do so. You guys can be pessimistic if you want, but the man with the money is saying they are ready to go big. I don't see any reason to doubt that.  

[Toddguy]

40 minutes ago, cbussoccer said:

You guys seem to be totally ignoring the articles that came out this past summer which talked pretty extensively about Easton's future. 

 

https://gatehousenews.com/eastonanniversary/latest-easton-expansion-focuses-on-an-edgy-urban-vibe/site/dispatch.com/

 

And then there's this:

 

The expansion that's currently under construction is just a tiny sliver of what's to come. Easton management know they must incorporate much more residential space and they are preparing to do so. You guys can be pessimistic if you want, but the man with the money is saying they are ready to go big. I don't see any reason to doubt that.  

Quote

"The next round of development will be 20- or 40-story buildings, a combination of office and residential, condos, or complete mixed-use buildings with a hotel, residential and commercial," said Leslie H. Wexner, founder of Easton and chairman of L Brands.

When I see construction start on a 20 story(or more)building at Easton, then I will believe it. Until I see some evidence, I will remain at least somewhat skeptical.  That is a lot of talk-and I hope that they come through with it-but I will need some evidence. JMHO.  This is Cbus, and actions speak louder than words when it comes to development unfortunately 

 

*If they do all of this, I will be lauding them loudly and eating all of this skepticism of course. 

[jonoh81]

59 minutes ago, cbussoccer said:

You guys seem to be totally ignoring the articles that came out this past summer which talked pretty extensively about Easton's future. 

 

https://gatehousenews.com/eastonanniversary/latest-easton-expansion-focuses-on-an-edgy-urban-vibe/site/dispatch.com/

 

And then there's this:

 

The expansion that's currently under construction is just a tiny sliver of what's to come. Easton management know they must incorporate much more residential space and they are preparing to do so. You guys can be pessimistic if you want, but the man with the money is saying they are ready to go big. I don't see any reason to doubt that.  

 

To be fair, 200 acres is relatively small to be building a whole new neighborhood of 20-40 story buildings and thousands of residential units, especially compared to the overall 1300 acres. I'd be curious to know where they are expecting to put all this development?  The problem is that with limited space directly adjacent to Easton, any future development would not be connected to Easton itself and it becomes less cohesive.  Unless they're planning to buy up already developed land and tear things down, that is, but that seems less practical given that little of the nearby development is very old.  I guess we'll see, but  I think the claims for such large development are probably more aspirational than anything that's being seriously planned at this point.

Edited December 13, 2019 by jonoh81

[DTCL11]

I'm not ignoring it, just treating it like an Arshot project. I guess I'm going on the idea that from its inception, Easton promise of Live, Work, Play has been promising more residences for 20 years with little to show for talking about future residential phases for, what is now, 2 decades. 

[cbussoccer]

12 minutes ago, Toddguy said:

When I see construction start on a 20 story(or more)building at Easton, then I will believe it. Until I see some evidence, I will remain at least somewhat skeptical.  That is a lot of talk-and I hope that they come through with it-but I will need some evidence. JMHO.  This is Cbus, and actions speak louder than words when it comes to development unfortunately 

 

*If they do all of this, I will be lauding them loudly and eating all of this skepticism of course. 

 

Like I said, be as pessimistic as you want. I'm simply pointing out that the man with the money is saying they will be doing what you want them to do. 

[aderwent]

6 minutes ago, jonoh81 said:

 

To be fair, 200 acres is very small to be building a whole new neighborhood of 20-40 story buildings and thousands of residential units.  I'd be curious to know where they are expecting to put all this development?  The problem is that with limited space directly adjacent to Easton, any future development would not be connected to Easton itself and it becomes less cohesive.  Unless they're planning to buy up already developed land and tear things down, that is, but that seems less practical given that little of the nearby development is very old.  I think the claims for such large development are probably more aspirational than anything that's being seriously planned at this point.

They also said they want to literally build upon what is already there. The retail and garages were built to be able to be built on top of. Then they want to fill in any remaining surface lots. So the 20,000 units they said they want to be a part of Easton will come not only on currently vacant land, but also among Easton's already developed parts.

 

I'm with cbussoccer. There was tons of discussion on this just a few months ago. Go reread the articles.

[jonoh81]

1 minute ago, aderwent said:

They also said they want to literally build upon what is already there. The retail and garages were built to be able to be built on top of. Then they want to fill in any remaining surface lots. So the 20,000 units they said they want to be a part of Easton will come not only on currently vacant land, but also among Easton's already developed parts.

 

I'm with cbussoccer. There was tons of discussion on this just a few months ago. Go reread the articles.

 

Not saying it's impossible, but we can't even get that type of development density Downtown.  What they're talking about is essentially creating a secondary downtown almost, which is extremely ambitious, to say the least. I'd love to see that, but I'm with others that I want to see actual plans, not just talk about an aspirational vision for 20 years in the future.  Easton Gateway was a terrible addition to this supposed vision, and it's curious why they didn't try to start pushing height and residential density with this latest phase instead of the still largely low-rise, non-residential it is.  I guess we'll see.

[DTCL11]

FWIW. The 2015 master plan released with the Easton Gateway project listed the area now being developed as future residential and people were excited for that too. Yes, master plans change. But that's pretty much my point, is residential continues to get bumped for retail. 

 

 

[cbussoccer]

7 minutes ago, DTCL11 said:

I'm not ignoring it, just treating it like an Arshot project. I guess I'm going on the idea that from its inception, Easton promise of Live, Work, Play has been promising more residences for 20 years with little to show for talking about future residential phases for, what is now, 2 decades. 

 

If you are equating the continued development of Easton over the past two decades with Arshot failing to build a race track on the edge of downtown and a speculative tower, then I would encourage you to come back to reality. 

 

Also, they built hundreds of residential units right off the bat. Then they increased the amount of retail, restaurants, and built office space, and now they are set up to add in more residence. Allow me to remind you that these places exist:

 

 

 

[cbussoccer]

1 minute ago, DTCL11 said:

FWIW. The 2015 master plan released with the Easton Gateway project listed the area now being developed as future residential and people were excited for that too. Yes, master plans change. But that's pretty much my point, is residential continues to get bumped for retail. 

 

 

 

They are about to build a 7-story residential building as part of this current expansion at the corner of Worth and Stelzer. We've been over this. 

[DTCL11]

Im aware. 750 units if I remember correctly. But that's where it began and stopped. Followed by 20 years of 'future residential'... if that doesn't sound like Arshot, I'm not sure what else does. Again, let's see plans and then believe they are serious about it. 

[DTCL11]

9 minutes ago, cbussoccer said:

 

They are about to build a 7-story residential building as part of this current expansion at the corner of Worth and Stelzer. We've been over this. 

 

And some of us acknowledged that and want to see a greater push. That contentment isn't what we want to see. That's how this conversation started. My original statement was just that. That one potential residential building is not enough to convince me at this point. Which is a valid concern IMO.  We can talk In circles all day but some of us want more and more pressure from the city to get it done. 

Edited December 13, 2019 by DTCL11

[cbussoccer]

2 minutes ago, DTCL11 said:

Im aware. 750 units if I remember correctly. But that's where it began and stopped. Followed by 20 years of 'future residential'... if that doesn't sound like Arshot, I'm not sure what else does. Again, let's see plans and then believe they are serious about it. 

 

They built a massive outdoor shopping center along with restaurants and offices which has become a must-do for almost everyone who visits Columbus. People actually drive into Columbus just to go to Easton. 

 

That sounds nothing like Arshot failing to build a race track in an old minor league baseball stadium next to a cemetery on the edge of downtown. 

[cbussoccer]

1 minute ago, DTCL11 said:

And some of us acknowledged that and want to see a greater push.

 

And I'm showing you that they've said they are literally in the process of doing exactly that. 

[Toddguy]

36 minutes ago, cbussoccer said:

 

Like I said, be as pessimistic as you want. I'm simply pointing out that the man with the money is saying they will be doing what you want them to do. 

I am not being pessimistic...more like cautiously optimistic/hopeful. Do not misrepresent what people are saying. I never said I was being pessimistic at all.  Just because someone does not immediately believe that 20,000 residences will be built along with 20-40 story towers just because an old rich guy who is not going to be around that much longer has said so does not make them a  pessimist...more like a realist actually.

 

The more progress they make towards this goal, then the more optimistic I will get. That will be moving from realistic to optimistic, ok?  Promising 20,000 residences and 20 and 40 story towers is a lot to promise-the only thing we have had in central Ohio even remotely like that is around OSU. Outside of that there is ONE tower outside of the CBD that is 20 floors or more-Summit Chase in Grandview, and that is about 50 years old. I am listening to what he is promising, but also wondering how realistic it is for those promises to be carried out-especially since he will unfortunately not be around himself to see it through, and what has happened in Central Ohio in the past.  Just saying and all.

 

I appreciate and respect your enthusiasm and optimism, so try to respect that I have some doubts but also share the same hope that this does all come to fruition. Just because we wonder if this will come through or not does not mean we do not want it to come through. 

[Toddguy]

1 hour ago, cbussoccer said:

You guys seem to be totally ignoring the articles that came out this past summer which talked pretty extensively about Easton's future. 

 

https://gatehousenews.com/eastonanniversary/latest-easton-expansion-focuses-on-an-edgy-urban-vibe/site/dispatch.com/

 

And then there's this:

 

The expansion that's currently under construction is just a tiny sliver of what's to come. Easton management know they must incorporate much more residential space and they are preparing to do so. You guys can be pessimistic if you want, but the man with the money is saying they are ready to go big. I don't see any reason to doubt that.  

You can't be buying this hook line and sinker when it clearly states this is game changing, and then post this:

 

Quote

Nobody here is claiming that Easton is doing anything "game changing for urbanism". 

 

 

yes what they are describing is game changing for urbanism-here is a quote from what you posted they are planning.

Quote

The biggest shift is Easton will become denser and more vertical. We see it as more of an urban neighborhood

 

That sounds game changing for urbanism to me for Easton.  And yes I would LOVE to see this happen in my lifetime. But I am not going to put on the rose colored glasses just quite yet.

Edited December 13, 2019 by Toddguy
blah blah blah

[cbussoccer]

4 minutes ago, Toddguy said:

I am not being pessimistic...more like cautiously optimistic/hopeful. Do not misrepresent what people are saying. I never said I was being pessimistic at all.

 

Well, that's exactly the opposite of what you said in your original response to me. You said, "When I see construction start on a 20 story(or more)building at Easton, then I will believe it. Until I see some evidence, I will remain at least somewhat skeptical." You went on to say, "If they do all of this, I will be lauding them loudly and eating all of this skepticism of course." 

 

Pessimistic and skeptical are synonyms of each other. You could substitute pessimistic for skeptical and skepticism and it wouldn't change the substance of what you said at all. Therefore, I did not misrepresent you in the slightest. 

 

7 minutes ago, Toddguy said:

Promising 20,000 residences and 20 and 40 story towers is a lot to promise-the only thing we have had in central Ohio even remotely like that is around OSU. Outside of that there is ONE tower outside of the CBD that is 20 floors or more-Summit Chase in Grandview, and that is about 50 years old. I am listening to what he is promising, but also wondering how realistic it is for those promises to be carried out-especially since he will unfortunately not be around himself to see it through, and what has happened in Central Ohio in the past.  Just saying and all.

 

Before they built Easton, things like Easton didn't exist. Now they do. Building a 20-story tower at Easton is much less speculative than actually building Easton itself was 25 years ago. 

 

 

 

[cbussoccer]

2 minutes ago, Toddguy said:

You can't be buying this hook line and sinker when it clearly states this is game changing, and then post this:

 

 

 

yes what they are describing is game changing for urbanism-here is a quote from what you posted they are planning.

 

That sounds game changing for urbanism to me for Easton.

 

I said Easton isn't going to do anything game changing for urbanism. I didn't say Easton won't do anything that will be game changing for the Easton area. That's an important distinction that you apparently did not comprehend. 

[Toddguy]

2 minutes ago, cbussoccer said:

 

Well, that's exactly the opposite of what you said in your original response to me. You said, "When I see construction start on a 20 story(or more)building at Easton, then I will believe it. Until I see some evidence, I will remain at least somewhat skeptical." You went on to say, "If they do all of this, I will be lauding them loudly and eating all of this skepticism of course." 

 

Pessimistic and skeptical are synonyms of each other. You could substitute pessimistic for skeptical and skepticism and it wouldn't change the substance of what you said at all. Therefore, I did not misrepresent you in the slightest. 

 

 

Before they built Easton, things like Easton didn't exist. Now they do. Building a 20-story tower at Easton is much less speculative than actually building Easton itself was 25 years ago. 

 

 

 

Quote

Pessimistic and skeptical are synonyms of each other.

They can be similar, but they also can be different:

 

skeptical:  not easily convinced; having doubts or reservations.

pessimistic: tending to see the worst aspect of things or believe that the worst will happen.

 

These are NOT the same thing.

[Toddguy]

Just now, cbussoccer said:

 

I said Easton isn't going to do anything game changing for urbanism. I didn't say Easton won't do anything that will be game changing for the Easton area. That's an important distinction that you apparently did not comprehend. 

 

If you are going to be insulting then let's just end this dialogue. I am not here for it. ok?

[DTCL11]

2 minutes ago, cbussoccer said:

 

They built a massive outdoor shopping center along with restaurants and offices which has become a must-do for almost everyone who visits Columbus. People actually drive into Columbus just to go to Easton. 

 

That sounds nothing like Arshot failing to build a race track in an old minor league baseball stadium next to a cemetery on the edge of downtown. 

 

We're not on the same page here. I'm not talking about Easton as a mall. Yes, they built a successful mall. I'm not disputing that. To your point, that's the only reason many people come to Columbus from other places and that's the only part of Columbus they know. They have not built a successful community despite saying that's the goal. It's a specific element of Easton (residential) I'm referring to as being arshot'esque. The parallels are even similar when you bring up the original Easton Commons in the early 2000s as I believe Arshot had a successful tower project then too people used to show they are capable of big tower projects. Or even that the new residential building was discovered online and still not formally released by Easton (like mini-Millenial)  I don't believe there is an actual equivalency between those two coincidences there but it is a bit funny in the parallel. My equating the two is specifically related to vague language on the future of a particular element of Easton. Easton was happy to tell us the exact square footage of every element of the retail and office and simply state 'residential' without putting any numbers or renderings to the residential portion, to this day. Putting the comparatives aside between Easton residential plans and Arshot, the skepticism is not unwarranted. Other than the 2008 downturn, it's not as if residential hasn't made any sense until now for such a 'visionary' group of developers. And perhaps they are seeing the error in failing to develop residential for so long and catching up.  I'll be happy to see the 300 Units as outlined in the permit but I'm waiting, cautiously, on how much more we are going to see anytime soon, particularly on any of the grand visions of Georgetown or Wexner, or if we are going to see it stop there with a master plan that shows future residential and wait another 5 or if it will be 20 years. I hope its 5, but won't be surprised if its 20. 

 

 

 

[cbussoccer]

1 minute ago, Toddguy said:

They can be similar, but they also can be different:

 

skeptical:  not easily convinced; having doubts or reservations.

pessimistic: tending to see the worst aspect of things or believe that the worst will happen.

 

These are NOT the same thing.

 

Again, you could substitute pessimistic for skeptical in your statement and it wouldn't change the meaning of what you said.

 

3 minutes ago, Toddguy said:

If you are going to be insulting then let's just end this dialogue. I am not here for it. ok?

 

I did not insult you. If you managed to find a way to be insulted by my statement, then that's your problem. 

 

[Toddguy]

9 minutes ago, cbussoccer said:

 

Again, you could substitute pessimistic for skeptical in your statement and it wouldn't change the meaning of what you said.

 

 

I did not insult you. If you managed to find a way to be insulted by my statement, then that's your problem. 

 

I disagree with your first line. I Know the meaning of what I said.

 

You responded to my saying I was being insulted by basically insulting me again(of course that is how I see it.)

This discussion has become unfriendly and has "attitude" IMO that is not conducive to any productive discussion, so let's just drop it, ok?-because the discussion is becoming problematic for the thread and for the board as a whole. 

Edited December 13, 2019 by Toddguy