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1 minute ago, Foraker said:

 

Just because you disagree with the branch of economics she follows doesn't mean she doesn't know anything about economics.  If you have a legitimate criticism of her economics positions, state that, not "as soon as she opens her mouth you know she's an idiot."  That's more comparable to playground name-calling than a serious discussion of the issues, despite the fact that it's our President's favorite skillset.

I disagree with Paul Krugman's branch of economics but I respect his logic and reasoning and in general, even though I disagree, he uses sound economic principles in his points. While I disagree with his analysis of the facts, his economic principles that he bases the analysis on are in line with conventional thinking. 

 

AOC misquotes basic supply and demand theory and seems to not have a basic understanding of the most basic economic principles. While I disagree with her analysis, her analysis is not defensible like Krugman because the facts she bases them off of are incorrect. 

 

That is the difference. 

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3 minutes ago, Brutus_buckeye said:

I disagree with Paul Krugman's branch of economics but I respect his logic and reasoning and in general, even though I disagree, he uses sound economic principles in his points. While I disagree with his analysis of the facts, his economic principles that he bases the analysis on are in line with conventional thinking. 

 

AOC misquotes basic supply and demand theory and seems to not have a basic understanding of the most basic economic principles. While I disagree with her analysis, her analysis is not defensible like Krugman because the facts she bases them off of are incorrect. 

 

That is the difference. 

 

Just so everyone is 100% clear, only the King buckeye himself can have the facts on his side. Carry on.

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50 minutes ago, Brutus_buckeye said:

I am sorry, what again makes him a fake doctor? 

And to your point, yes, an epidemiologist opinion would carry more weight that Rand Paul, whose opinion carries more weight than your opinion in one regard. However, the opinion of Dr. Fauci is not beyond reproach and needs to be recognized as just that, an opinion. At the end of the day, Dr. Fauci, like Amy Acton and all the other doctors, (including Rand Paul) are essentially flying blind. Nobody has dealt with this before and everyone's experience is no more than 4 months old at this point battling the disease.  It is fair to admit that Dr. Fauci does not have the answers yet at the same time recognizing that he is also a qualified "expert" on the matter. I dont think Paul would dispute that either. 

 

But 4 months into it, lets also look at the experts track record. For example, in early April Amy Acton predicted that there would be 8-10k Ohioans per day who would get COVID-19 even with the shutdown. We were not even close to this. Fauci has had many inconsistent statements throughout the last 3 months on the matter. Many of the predictions that he has cited have been wildly incorrect too. This does not mean these individuals do not possess credibility, however, it is also safe to admit that they do not have the answers the public needs right now and everyone is flying blind on this. Trusting everything they say like gospel is a folly too because they dont know either. Questioning from laymen or other individuals is appropriate because everyone is learning more about the disease daily together.  Furthermore, when you have the "expert" on multiple occasions be wrong, it is reasonable to question them before going forward no matter who you are.

 

I highlighted a couple things above just so I can have clarification here:

 

1.) What answers does the public need right now and does anyone actually have those answers?

 

2.) Of course it is reasonable to ask questions but tell me one expert or actually any one person who has been right and have their "wrongs" been any closer to the degree of "wrongs" that were said by the experts?

 

I don't understand why anyone can't admit "yeah litteraly no one actualy knows WTF is going on but probably the most qualified, experienced people on the planet will have the best knowledge and we should generally follow their advice. Also, even if we didn't follow their advice please tell me who else we should follow. It is still a free country and everyone can do what they want.

 

I also find that people talking about Hydroxychloroquine and Z-Pack and all this other stuff that by the way, Dr. Fauci himself had said at the time we can't say this works yet, didn't say it wouldn't but said there isn't any evidence yet, then all I am seeing now are these reports saying it doesn't work. It's like all these things, people think they know more than the experts. Here is the thing, to get to a point of professional accomplishment of Dr. Fauci, you need to do 20x more in your life than a Rand Paul. That is no offense to any Senator out there, it is just fact. That guy has given his life to public service and saving lives, when he could have made massive amounts of money in private healthcare and drug/vaccine development. He probably single handedly lead the drive to save millions of lives in the AIDS epidemic, in the past and currently.

 

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2766117

 

Dr. Fauci is in the top ten authors of peer reviewed research in the world ever in his field, or something crazy like that. I believe he is top 50 in the world of all time in regards to immunology. That is the smartest people in the world (Dr. Fauci's peers) fact checking the most complicated work in the world (Novel Diseases like HIV, AIDS, Ebola, Influenza) done by people (Dr. Fauci) which are smarter than them (Dr. Fauci's peers) otherwise they would have done the work themselves. That is Dr. Fauci. And just to reiterate again, NO ONE has to listen to his advice and he DID NOT make policy. If you got something better, go for it. Otherwise, it is just a sounding board to deflect attention off of themselves since they are incapable of making any decisions on their own because they lack the knowledge!

 

In a 2019 analysis of Google Scholar citations, Dr. Fauci ranked as the 41st most highly cited researcher of all time. According to the Web of Science, he ranked 8th out of more than 2.2 million authors in the field of immunology by total citation count between 1980 and January 2019.

 

You can read his profile here, I think we are beyond lucky to have Dr. Fauci in this world.

 

https://www.niaid.nih.gov/about/anthony-s-fauci-md-bio

 

 

 

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2 minutes ago, IAGuy39 said:

 

I highlighted a couple things above just so I can have clarification here:

 

1.) What answers does the public need right now and does anyone actually have those answers?

 

2.) Of course it is reasonable to ask questions but tell me one expert or actually any one person who has been right and have their "wrongs" been any closer to the degree of "wrongs" that were said by the experts?

 

I don't understand why anyone can't admit "yeah litteraly no one actualy knows WTF is going on but probably the most qualified, experienced people on the planet will have the best knowledge and we should generally follow their advice. Also, even if we didn't follow their advice please tell me who else we should follow. It is still a free country and everyone can do what they want.

 

I also find that people talking about Hydroxychloroquine and Z-Pack and all this other stuff that by the way, Dr. Fauci himself had said at the time we can't say this works yet, didn't say it wouldn't but said there isn't any evidence yet, then all I am seeing now are these reports saying it doesn't work. It's like all these things, people think they know more than the experts. Here is the thing, to get to a point of professional accomplishment of Dr. Fauci, you need to do 20x more in your life than a Rand Paul. That is no offense to any Senator out there, it is just fact. That guy has given his life to public service and saving lives, when he could have made massive amounts of money in private healthcare and drug/vaccine development. He probably single handedly lead the drive to save millions of lives in the AIDS epidemic, in the past and currently.

 

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2766117

 

Dr. Fauci is in the top ten authors of peer reviewed research in the world ever in his field, or something crazy like that. I believe he is top 50 in the world of all time in regards to immunology. That is the smartest people in the world (Dr. Fauci's peers) fact checking the most complicated work in the world (Novel Diseases like HIV, AIDS, Ebola, Influenza) done by people (Dr. Fauci) which are smarter than them (Dr. Fauci's peers) otherwise they would have done the work themselves. That is Dr. Fauci. And just to reiterate again, NO ONE has to listen to his advice and he DID NOT make policy. If you got something better, go for it. Otherwise, it is just a sounding board to deflect attention off of themselves since they are incapable of making any decisions on their own because they lack the knowledge!

 

In a 2019 analysis of Google Scholar citations, Dr. Fauci ranked as the 41st most highly cited researcher of all time. According to the Web of Science, he ranked 8th out of more than 2.2 million authors in the field of immunology by total citation count between 1980 and January 2019.

 

You can read his profile here, I think we are beyond lucky to have Dr. Fauci in this world.

 

https://www.niaid.nih.gov/about/anthony-s-fauci-md-bio

 

 

 

Dr. Fauci is a very accomplished Doctor. He is the leading epidimiologist in the country. That is not disputed. I never said we should not listen to the guy. BUt his words are guidance not gospel. They should be given importance but at the same time, we must also realize that he does not have the answers. People are looking for certainty and guidance in an environment where that does not exist. He should be treated as a very important voice in the room, but not the sole authority. 

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6 minutes ago, Clefan98 said:

 

Just so everyone is 100% clear, only the King buckeye himself can have the facts on his side. Carry on.

No, it just means that AOC is a moron when it comes to economics. Krugman uses sound economic principles too. I dont agree with the guy, but at least he starts from a baseline based on accepted economic theory. 

Edited by Brutus_buckeye

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1 minute ago, Brutus_buckeye said:

Dr. Fauci is a very accomplished Doctor. He is the leading epidimiologist in the country. That is not disputed. I never said we should not listen to the guy. BUt his words are guidance not gospel. They should be given importance but at the same time, we must also realize that he does not have the answers. People are looking for certainty and guidance in an environment where that does not exist. He should be treated as a very important voice in the room, but not the sole authority. 

 

I agree with you and I didn't go on my long post to really disagree with anything you said.

 

What I am saying is that I don't think anyone is saying he should be the sole voice unless you are talking about what the general population thinks. Government makes their own decisions and Dr. Fauci isn't making any policies himself. If people are upset about the policies they should take it up with their local enforcement and not blame it on Dr. Fauci like Rand Paul was trying to do yesterday to score political points. It is a pointless argument which Rand Paul knows.

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1 minute ago, IAGuy39 said:

 

I agree with you and I didn't go on my long post to really disagree with anything you said.

 

What I am saying is that I don't think anyone is saying he should be the sole voice unless you are talking about what the general population thinks. Government makes their own decisions and Dr. Fauci isn't making any policies himself. If people are upset about the policies they should take it up with their local enforcement and not blame it on Dr. Fauci like Rand Paul was trying to do yesterday to score political points. It is a pointless argument which Rand Paul knows.

I think DeWine accurately points that out with attacks on Acton. The important thing for the politicians to keep in mind is that they cant rely on one individual as the sole source that they rely on. During this time, people like Fauci and Acton have very important voices but cant be the only voice in the room. Our politicians need to do a better job of listening to all the stakeholders involved to make sure that they are not stuck in tunnel vision on any particular issue. 

 

 

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1 hour ago, Brutus_buckeye said:

He practiced in Bowling Green before he entered into Congress. 

The fact that he is not currently practicing does not mean he is not a doctor. If his license is inactive, he could easily activate it by paying the fee and registering with the board in KY. 

 

So what again makes him a fake doctor?

Being inactive does not mean he did not earn the credentials of being a doctor and is not able to resume practice at his choosing. I do not believe he was sanctioned at all by the medical board. 

 

I thought he was still doing pro bono eye surgeries in KY? 

 

Anyhow Paul's relationship to Trump dates back to Trump helping to finance Paul's charitable trips down in Central America. 

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1 minute ago, surfohio said:

 

I thought he was still doing pro bono eye surgeries in KY? 

 

Anyhow Paul's relationship to Trump dates back to Trump helping to finance Paul's charitable trips down in Central America. 

I dont know if his license is active or not. I was mainly just trying to address D&S question about him being a fake doctor. My point was it does not matter if he is currently licensed, he is still a doctor.

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2 hours ago, IAGuy39 said:

 

I agree that he is qualified to make an opinion just like anyone is. That said, the right is making this hugely vague talking point that makes absolute no sense:

 

1.) Rand Paul advised "The disease has been benign in Kentucky." Well I would ask in terms of what, the number of cases? In that term that is true and why is that? Because of mitigation? The CFR is not benign and not out of line with all the rest of the states if you just go by that measure. So, pretty much starting off with hugely false logic.

 

2.) He accused Dr. Fauci of being the "end all" or something that Dr. Fauci claimed he was though, he hasn't been the "end all" on any one thing. Dr. Paul can go talk to any Dr. and make decisions from any one of them. The WH in fact hasn't done Jack squat in terms of this pandemic or followed really any of Dr. Fauci's recommendations to a T, instead giving out very vague information. Last I checked, the Governors weren't getting orders from Dr. Fauci. They are making orders themselves based on the informatoin they are given from their state health director, who makes decisions based off of leading Drs. throughout his or her state, etc.

 

So, basically, people like Rand Paul are going to sit back and yell about Dr. Fauci when Dr. Fauci hasn't made any decision on his own. If people are mad because he has a ton of influence, then tell your governor to get a new influence or maybe just accept the fact that Dr. Fauci is one of the world's most renowned Doctors and his advice would be just as good as any one others.

 

I actually got into it last night with someone who was trying to argue that President Trump was brilliant and doing a great job except for his reliance on the bad advice of an "incompetent" Dr. Fauci. I have to wonder how many people really share that opinion, because it sure seems like a significant number. 

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So who do I call to make an complaint for a store not enforcing face masks for Employees?

 

I was at Kenwood mall and it was scary. Barely anyone in masks as far as customers and there were quite a few employees without masks in various stores. 

 

Nothing is being enforced and an air conditioned building with recycled air is the perfect place for a massive spread of covid. 

 

 

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2 hours ago, Brutus_buckeye said:

He practiced in Bowling Green before he entered into Congress. 

The fact that he is not currently practicing does not mean he is not a doctor. If his license is inactive, he could easily activate it by paying the fee and registering with the board in KY. 

 

So what again makes him a fake doctor?

Being inactive does not mean he did not earn the credentials of being a doctor and is not able to resume practice at his choosing. I do not believe he was sanctioned at all by the medical board. 

When it comes to Infectious Disease/Inmunology and Epidemiology, I'll go with Tony Fauci vs Rand Paul, all day, every day, 365.

 

Rand Paul was positioned to be the torchbearer of the alt-right's neverending attempts to discredit Tony Fauci. They've been trying to discredit him for months now. You could see Rand Paul biting at the bit to get his turn. It was a set-up, that anyone familiar with the issue could see coming.

 

As usual, Rand Paul fell flat on his face.

Edited by Frmr CLEder

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47 minutes ago, surfohio said:

I have to wonder how many people really share that opinion, because it sure seems like a significant number

I can assure you, they are Republicans fueled by the Alt-Right conspiracy theories - Tony Fauci and Bill Gates attempts to immunize the globe so they can control the global population. It's another one of their ridiculous conspiracy theories that the gullibles are force fed as if they're npo and on a PEG.

Edited by Frmr CLEder

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41 minutes ago, troeros said:

So who do I call to make an complaint for a store not enforcing face masks for Employees?

 

I was at Kenwood mall and it was scary. Barely anyone in masks as far as customers and there were quite a few employees without masks in various stores. 

 

Nothing is being enforced and an air conditioned building with recycled air is the perfect place for a massive spread of covid. 

 

 

 

So... why were you there?

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14 minutes ago, jonoh81 said:

 

So... why were you there?

 

Because my girlfriend works there and I dropped her off lunch? 

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55 minutes ago, Frmr CLEder said:

I can assure you, they are Republicans fueled by the Alt-Right conspiracy theories - Tony Fauci and Bill Gates attempts to immunize the globe so they can control the global population. It's another one of their ridiculous conspiracy theories that the gullibles are force fed as if they're npo and on a PEG.

 

How do they reconcile that Trump is so wise and a champion of the people, yet he's incapable of warning the American people about this evil conspiracy?  The conspiracy is so stupid, but what's even more perplexing is their idea that Trump bears no responsibility while he's being unwittingly used by these devils lol. 

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The "New World Order," of which Bill Gates and Tony Fauci are supposed to be key players, is being propagated by Fox News pundits, ultra-conservatives and some Evangelicans; they're all over FB and You Tube.

 

Trump is affiliated because of their support. Whether he buys in to it or not, isn't clear, but he definitely has no love for Bill Gates. Trump tolerates Fauci, because he's too highly respected and Trump knows he would face a fire storm if he attempted to get rid of him, but he would if he could and has attempted to silence Fauci as much as he possibly can.

Edited by Frmr CLEder

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1 hour ago, troeros said:

 

Because my girlfriend works there and I dropped her off lunch? 

 

His stupid question deserved a more smart ass reply. 😜

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3 hours ago, Brutus_buckeye said:

I dont know if his license is active or not. I was mainly just trying to address D&S question about him being a fake doctor. My point was it does not matter if he is currently licensed, he is still a doctor.


Not in any way defending his politics or his qualifications to comment on epidemiology, but he is an actively licensed physician in the state of Kentucky.

 

Name: 

Randal H. Paul M.D.

Address: 

200 Lakeside Way

City, State, Zip: 

Bowling Green KY 42103

Phone: 

(270) 792-6767

License: 

29638

Status: 

Active Physician

Expiration: 

2/28/2021 0:00:00

Practice County: 

Warren

*Area of Practice: 

Ophthalmology

Type of Practice: 

Private Practice

Year Licensed in KY: 

6/28/1993 0:00:00

Medical School: 

Duke University School of Medicine, Durham

Year Graduated: 

1988

Board Action: 

None

http://web1.ky.gov/GenSearch/LicenseSearch.aspx?AGY=5

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5 hours ago, Brutus_buckeye said:

He practiced in Bowling Green before he entered into Congress. 

The fact that he is not currently practicing does not mean he is not a doctor. If his license is inactive, he could easily activate it by paying the fee and registering with the board in KY. 

 

So what again makes him a fake doctor?

Being inactive does not mean he did not earn the credentials of being a doctor and is not able to resume practice at his choosing. I do not believe he was sanctioned at all by the medical board. 

 

Quote

In the spring of 2010 stories first swirled around Sen. Rand Paul’s certification as an ophthalmologist by an outfit called the “National Ophthalmology Board,” an entity he founded.

 

The board he created to give himself a certification as an opthalmologist has never been deemed to be legitimate.  Has many times said he holds bachelor's degrees he never earned.

 

Fauci>Paul

Edited by DarkandStormy

Very Stable Genius

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3 minutes ago, DarkandStormy said:

 

 

The board he created to give himself a certification as an opthalmologist has never been deemed to be legitimate.  Has many times said he holds bachelor's degrees he never earned.

 

Fauci>Paul

this is not a Fauci vs Paul thing. But you are 100% incorrect when you refer to him as a fake doctor. 

 

As shown above, he holds a KY medical license. He went to Duke for Med School and completed a residency. That makes him a real  doctor. No further debate. Whether he may or may not be board certified is irrelevant. Thanks for playing

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5 hours ago, Brutus_buckeye said:

I disagree with Paul Krugman's branch of economics but I respect his logic and reasoning and in general, even though I disagree, he uses sound economic principles in his points. While I disagree with his analysis of the facts, his economic principles that he bases the analysis on are in line with conventional thinking. 

 

AOC misquotes basic supply and demand theory and seems to not have a basic understanding of the most basic economic principles. While I disagree with her analysis, her analysis is not defensible like Krugman because the facts she bases them off of are incorrect. 

 

That is the difference. 

 

 

You've said this before and when asked to give one example you couldn't. And you even admitted that you have rarely even listened to her speak. You're just basing your opinions off of right wing talking points.

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Doctors don't know much about stuff outside of their specialties.  That's why doctors...go to the doctor.  Kind of like how divorce or bankruptcy or copyright attorneys hire DUI lawyers if they get pulled over.  Kind of like how business reporters don't do restaurant reviews and advice columnists don't cover college basketball. 

 

 

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AOC has zero to do with this discussion.  Next person to mention AOC gets time off.

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20 hours ago, Brutus_buckeye said:

As shown above, he holds a KY medical license. He went to Duke for Med School and completed a residency. That makes him a real  doctor. No further debate. Whether he may or may not be board certified is irrelevant. Thanks for playing

While Rand Paul may hold a KY medical license, any physician requesting a consult for a hospitalized patient with MRSA or Pseudomonas, or EHEC or even SARS-CoV-2, would never consider seeking the advice of an Opthamologist, unless the infection was in the eye, and even then, they would still consult with an Infectious Disease Specialist.

 

The American public, should as well.

Edited by Frmr CLEder

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The fact that Trump's camp has swung our attention to an epidemiologist who, in any other administration, is barely known, shows how good they are at deflecting blame and distracting from negative news. 

 

Tara Reade didn't stick --> Fauci critiques grow --> OBAMAGATE

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10 hours ago, Brutus_buckeye said:

this is not a Fauci vs Paul thing. But you are 100% incorrect when you refer to him as a fake doctor. 

 

As shown above, he holds a KY medical license. He went to Duke for Med School and completed a residency. That makes him a real  doctor. No further debate. Whether he may or may not be board certified is irrelevant. Thanks for playing

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/right-turn/wp/2013/11/08/rand-paul-has-another-problem/

 

Full disclosure - here was the source I was referencing:

Quote

Since 2005 Rand Paul has not been certified by any board recognized by the state of Kentucky, and since 2011 has had no certification since the NOB was dissolved.

 

And...

Error in reading "has no certification to practice medicine" as "licensed to practice medicine."

 

Anyway, I get why you're defending him.  He's on your team and is giving an opinion you likely share.  If you want to sway the, "let's believe the experts" crowd, you should probably find an epidemiologist or two advocating what Paul is saying, rather than a "self-certified" *OPTHAMOLOGIST* who obviously has no principles on the matter.

 

https://www.politico.com/story/2014/10/rand-paul-ebola-111547

 

 

Quote

Sen. Rand Paul is warning that the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention might be downplaying the threat from the Ebola virus.

 

The Kentucky Republican, appearing on “The Laura Ingraham Show” on Wednesday, said the CDC and the Obama administration are giving off a false sense of security.

 

“I think because of political correctness we’re not really making sound, rational, scientific decisions on this,” the senator said. “It’s a big mistake to underestimate the potential for problems worldwide.”

 

And he tweeted this when two Americans had died of Ebola:

 

So, I'm not really sure why we should be giving credence to him at all.


Very Stable Genius

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^ Trump's camp is only good at deflection with their base. They are the ones desperate to attach to an "alternate reality" so that they don't have to face the disappointment that exists within their own lives.

Anyone with an ounce of intellect and/or common sense recognizes their attempts to deflect and are unphased.

Edited by Frmr CLEder

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Have we talked about how Trump doesn't understand testing?

 

Or how the White House is only operating precisely because they're conducting multi-week tests of everyone, isolating those infected, and tracing back their contacts and telling them to isolate?  If that's how the White House is running, why aren't they advocating that same level of testing and contact tracing for every other worker in America?


Very Stable Genius

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12 minutes ago, YABO713 said:

Burisma/Hunter Biden found out to be non-story -> Tara Reade didn't stick --> Fauci critiques grow --> OBAMAGATE

 

FTFY.

 

Obamagate is really his laziest conspiracy theory yet.  At least with Seth Rich you had someone die.  Same for all the "Clinton body count" stories.  Heck, even the 9/11 truthers found some semblance of a fact to hold onto - "jet fuel doesn't melt steel."  Obamagate is naming the conspiracy without any of the ground work laid by low level trolls and talk radio hacks.  He's declared it a conspiracy and a crime before any grown men in their mom's basement even made a YouTube video with their string on a board to "PROOVE" the crime and before Glenn Beck or Alex Jones gave it life in the conservative media-sphere.  Really putting the cart before the horse on this one.


Very Stable Genius

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5 minutes ago, DarkandStormy said:

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/right-turn/wp/2013/11/08/rand-paul-has-another-problem/

 

Full disclosure - here was the source I was referencing:

 

And...

Error in reading "has no certification to practice medicine" as "licensed to practice medicine."

 

Anyway, I get why you're defending him.  He's on your team and is giving an opinion you likely share.  If you want to sway the, "let's believe the experts" crowd, you should probably find an epidemiologist or two advocating what Paul is saying, rather than a "self-certified" *OPTHAMOLOGIST* who obviously has no principles on the matter.

 

https://www.politico.com/story/2014/10/rand-paul-ebola-111547

 

 

 

And he tweeted this when two Americans had died of Ebola:

 

So, I'm not really sure why we should be giving credence to him at all.

I was just trying to get the record straight that he was in fact a real doctor and does in fact have medical knowledge on the subject even if he would not be considered an expert. Does he command the same authority of Fauci, of course not. they are far from equals on the epidemiology subject matter. However, he does possess knowledge on the matter, given his medical background that give him more credence than the layman or maybe non-medical politician. 

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The last thing struggling businesses employees need is to face a financially crippling lawsuit die from an irresponsible employer.

 

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25 minutes ago, Brutus_buckeye said:

I was just trying to get the record straight that he was in fact a real doctor and does in fact have medical knowledge on the subject even if he would not be considered an expert. Does he command the same authority of Fauci, of course not. they are far from equals on the epidemiology subject matter. However, he does possess knowledge on the matter, given his medical background that give him more credence than the layman or maybe non-medical politician. 

 

I have a relative who is a biologist and an anti-vaxxer. So education doesn't erase the fact that she's nuts. And I realized she was nuts before I learned she was anti-vaxxer. Sometimes the wires don't line up in people.


"Life is 10% what happens to you and 90% how you respond." -- Coach Lou Holtz

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1 hour ago, DarkandStormy said:

 

FTFY.

 

Obamagate is really his laziest conspiracy theory yet.  At least with Seth Rich you had someone die.  Same for all the "Clinton body count" stories.  Heck, even the 9/11 truthers found some semblance of a fact to hold onto - "jet fuel doesn't melt steel."  Obamagate is naming the conspiracy without any of the ground work laid by low level trolls and talk radio hacks.  He's declared it a conspiracy and a crime before any grown men in their mom's basement even made a YouTube video with their string on a board to "PROOVE" the crime and before Glenn Beck or Alex Jones gave it life in the conservative media-sphere.  Really putting the cart before the horse on this one.

 

So obviously, this deserves to go nowhere because:

 

1. Thousands of Americans are dying everyday

2. Obama couldn't have conspired if the suspect needed to be unmasked.

3. If Obama did conspire, Trump set the precedent that it's okay to investigate people for political aims.

 

Nonetheless, while I vehemently disagree with Obama on policy, he would absolutely flame every Senator on the intel committee as a witness. 

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1 hour ago, Brutus_buckeye said:

However, he does possess knowledge on the matter, given his medical background that give him more credence than the layman or maybe non-medical politician. 

Unfortunately, Rand Paul was the best the Republican-led Senate Committee had to offer, and he was very weak compared to a world-reknowned infectious disease specialist and epidemiologist on this issue. Opthamology, on the other hand, would more than likely cede to Paul.

Edited by Frmr CLEder

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53 minutes ago, KJP said:

I have a relative who is a biologist and an anti-vaxxer. So education doesn't erase the fact that she's nuts. And I realized she was nuts before I learned she was anti-vaxxer. Sometimes the wires don't line up in people.

 

Fun fact: Rand Paul is also an anti-vaxxer.


Very Stable Genius

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16 minutes ago, DarkandStormy said:

 

 

What's amazing is that he is too stupid to realize that the pace we're losing people at means that he's going to have to keep upping his "projection" every few days to keep up.  That, or he knows his base has the memory of a goldfish.

 

1 hour ago, Brutus_buckeye said:

I was just trying to get the record straight that he was in fact a real doctor and does in fact have medical knowledge on the subject [of eyeballs] even if he would not be considered an expert. Does he command the same authority of Fauci, of course not. they are far from equals on the epidemiology subject matter. However, he does possess knowledge on the matter, given his medical background that give him more credence than the layman or maybe non-medical politician. 

 

I added the part that you forgot.

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Strange times indeed when a white man can't carry an ax to a protest with other armed white men.  For shame!  

 

 

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39 minutes ago, X said:

 

I added the part that you forgot.

So to clarify things about Paul. His medical school program was pretty much the same as Dr. Fauci's and his residency during the first 4 years would likely be similar too (Please note, that give the difference in ages, there is obviously going to be differences). But the point is that a doctor who goes to medical school learns the same things as every other med student. The residency programs are pretty standard with the exception that you do a surgical residency or primary care/internal medicine tracks. After the initial residency period, that is where the docs go to fellowship to get very specialized in their craft and obviously the minute expertise in certain areas emerge. 

 

Also, just in case, many people confuse the ophthalmologist with optometrist. The former is a medical doctor and you must go to medical school to obtain. They are the same as every other medical doctor and while their focus is on the eyes, they are often also dual certified in internal medicine and can treat patients with all ailments much like any general practitioner can. A optometrist is not a medical doctor and not licensed by the medical board. While often called doctors, they are not quite to that level (less training, etc.) and they may only see patients for matters concerning the eyes and scope is solely eye related. 

 

Paul is an actual medical doctor who specializes in eyes. If you come to him with pneumonia or a broken leg, he may treat it but that would be ill advised. If you go to an optometrist, they will tell you to seek attention from a medical doctor. 

 

My point is that while he may have specialized as an eye doctor, he much of the same general knowledge to allow him to understand most complex medical concepts. He can speak Dr. Fauci's language. He may not be anywhere near Fauci's level, but he can at least ask challenging questions on the medical side and have credibility as he understands the medical terminology. This is not trying to diminish Fauci, or say Paul is an expert in epidemiology (he clearly is not), but simply to say that his background brings a certain experience to the table that other Senators do not have. 

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5 minutes ago, Brutus_buckeye said:

So to clarify things about Paul. His medical school program was pretty much the same as Dr. Fauci's and his residency during the first 4 years would likely be similar too (Please note, that give the difference in ages, there is obviously going to be differences). But the point is that a doctor who goes to medical school learns the same things as every other med student. The residency programs are pretty standard with the exception that you do a surgical residency or primary care/internal medicine tracks. After the initial residency period, that is where the docs go to fellowship to get very specialized in their craft and obviously the minute expertise in certain areas emerge. 

 

Also, just in case, many people confuse the ophthalmologist with optometrist. The former is a medical doctor and you must go to medical school to obtain. They are the same as every other medical doctor and while their focus is on the eyes, they are often also dual certified in internal medicine and can treat patients with all ailments much like any general practitioner can. A optometrist is not a medical doctor and not licensed by the medical board. While often called doctors, they are not quite to that level (less training, etc.) and they may only see patients for matters concerning the eyes and scope is solely eye related. 

 

Paul is an actual medical doctor who specializes in eyes. If you come to him with pneumonia or a broken leg, he may treat it but that would be ill advised. If you go to an optometrist, they will tell you to seek attention from a medical doctor. 

 

My point is that while he may have specialized as an eye doctor, he much of the same general knowledge to allow him to understand most complex medical concepts. He can speak Dr. Fauci's language. He may not be anywhere near Fauci's level, but he can at least ask challenging questions on the medical side and have credibility as he understands the medical terminology. This is not trying to diminish Fauci, or say Paul is an expert in epidemiology (he clearly is not), but simply to say that his background brings a certain experience to the table that other Senators do not have. 

 

 

it a real shame he used that medical knowledge to manipulate hillbillies then

Edited by GCrites80s

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2 minutes ago, mrnyc said:

^ exactly.

 

i suspect most internet warriors who disparage aoc do so because they are attracted to her, but as incels they dont have a prayer, than over her politics.

 

i mean its a woman. in a position of power. saying things. and of color. my god. mind blown.

 

don't get me started lol.

 

also, per the actual facts, aoc is only the 17th most liberal rep. q: who is more lib? a: who tf knows?!! they are probably old and ugly men lol. also, she doesnt do bills, but she is present and votes more than most if not all the other reps. in sum, she hardly rates mentioning by anybody, but the right wingers make her a rock star.

Please read the mod rules about AOC comments on this thread

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^ oh, i see i was about a page off on that, but you quoted it so it wont matter if i delete it. maybe we both can delete?

 

 

*** 

 

did anyone see this yet? yikes -- pretty scary.

 

 

 

Watch: Viral Japanese Video Shows How Quickly COVID-19 Can Spread At A Buffet

 

https://www.forbes.com/sites/suzannerowankelleher/2020/05/11/watch-viral-japanese-video-shows-how-quickly-covid-19-can-spread-at-a-buffet/#2e5d3dfa24a5

 

spacer.png

Edited by mrnyc

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Can everyone just stop about Rand Paul who we all know is just a shill for Trump at this point?- just ignore the idiot who keeps promoting him on here.  

Rated:

 

Fauci

 

 

other top noted epidemiologists 

 

 

 

 

 

other top rated doctors

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Regular MD's

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Regular Opthamologists

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

All other healthcare workers including vets

 

 

 

 

Average Joe Schoe

 

 

 

Rand Paul...Opthamologist political mule for *you know who* and dumb antivaxxer.

 

 

And when it comes to Trump, everybody better be constantly harping on everything he said wrong and lied about regarding this pandemic. I mean non-stop political ads flooding every means of communication attacking him on his response to this pandemic(along with everything else.)  (Enough with him as this is not his thread)

 

We have passed 300,000 deaths worldwide and 85,000 deaths in the US. https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

 

147,000 deaths predicted by August 1 with this model. https://covid19.healthdata.org/united-states-of-america

 

I think that a second wave is going to push the totals up higher-just look at that mess in Wisconsin right now smh.  I am really hoping at least we get another treatment drug and they are really working on collecting as much antibody plasma as possible. 

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