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can't they just move totally to a mail in or online voting procedure instead of as needed? a la oregon.

 

i mean thats screwed for this election, but at least its fixable.

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1 hour ago, Cleburger said:

 

"But MUH sOCialIZED medisine" 

 

It's becoming clear that in other countries around the world with nationalized healthcare of some sort, they are way better equipped to deal with these kinds of medical emergencies.  

 

So, Italy, with their failing healthcare system that's also overwhelmed? Iran? China?

 

We build hospitals for the capacity we need in most situations, with provisions for a few extra beds/ICU units for emergencies. No hospital in the world is equipped to deal with pandemics that overwhelms the entire medical system. Hospital beds/ICU units are very expensive to build and no government or private entity will build such a facility only to have the equipment remain idle and deteriorate.

 

One of the best things that's come out of this is that we've enabled private corporations to be the drivers of some of the testing facilities since they are more readily accessible than hospitals by sheer volume. Wal-Mart/Target/CVS/Walgreens are offering drive-through testing facilities (or will very soon) and there are plenty more of those locations than hospitals. The more we can test, the better.

Edited by seicer

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4 minutes ago, IAGuy39 said:

 

Maybe I should have explained more - my dad works for Ohio Health and said they finally started testing for covid-19.  But before that, they were running RVPs, which test for up to 20 common viruses, including other coronaviruses, influenza, etc.  So if they got a positive ID on one of those, they can reasonably rule out covid-19.  It's the panels that come back all negative for a patient with "flu-like symptoms" that make it harder to diagnose.


Very Stable Genius

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10 minutes ago, seicer said:

One of the best things that's come out of this is that we've enabled private corporations to be the drivers of some of the testing facilities since they are more readily accessible than hospitals by sheer volume. Wal-Mart/Target/CVS/Walgreens are offering drive-through testing facilities (or will very soon) and there are plenty more of those locations than hospitals. The more we can test, the better.


Yes. How nice of them to donate part of their parking lots for drive-thru testing that a vast majority of the nation still doesn’t have. 

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12 minutes ago, DarkandStormy said:

 

Maybe I should have explained more - my dad works for Ohio Health and said they finally started testing for covid-19.  But before that, they were running RVPs, which test for up to 20 common viruses, including other coronaviruses, influenza, etc.  So if they got a positive ID on one of those, they can reasonably rule out covid-19.  It's the panels that come back all negative for a patient with "flu-like symptoms" that make it harder to diagnose.

 

Makes sense, thanks for explaining! I think they are doing this anyways maybe? Then doing the COVID-19 test.

 

I wonder if they had enough tests .... "the millions" that Pence promised, that if they could quickly go through some of the tests like give them the flu one quickly then move right into COVID-19 if they are negative there?

 

Really when you think about the lack of tests, to me that is what is ruining the economy. If we had "bit the bullet" back in January or whatever and had tests ready to roll out, then we wouldn't necessarily need to shut everything down like we do now. I can't think of anyone not being extremely angry at the President as this thing drags on, and people learn the reason we don't have tests is because the administration didn't order them and didn't want the "numbers to be high". Because that is LITERALLY what Trump said on live TV!!!

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2 hours ago, Gordon Bombay said:


Yes. How nice of them to donate part of their parking lots for drive-thru testing that a vast majority of the nation still doesn’t have. 

 

And if and when the tests arrive, folks can easily get a drive-through swab within minutes. It's a lot better than going to the one medical center that may be in your community (and many are without such facilities). If properly executed and staffed, that's 16,400 locations across the nation. (This is absent of the politics around our botched testing of COVID, and the downplaying of the severity of the issue.) You sound like you are complaining about a bi-partisan, unique solution when you offer up nothing better.

 

By the way, South Korea and China both had widespread use of drive-through testing facilities on parking lots nationwide, many on store lots.

 

--

 

Ohio Gov. Mike DeWine’s coronavirus response has become a national guide to the crisis

 

As a global pandemic each day transforms the unthinkable into America’s new reality, the path is being guided by an unlikely leader: the short and bespectacled 73-year-old Republican governor of America’s seventh-most-populous state. [...] The governor’s ahead-of-the-curve response has won raves from public health experts and from politicians of both parties, who say DeWine’s reliance on medical advice and his unwillingness to put a sheen on the crisis’s damaging impact stands out — particularly when compared with the response from the Trump White House.

Edited by seicer

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I don't get the point of delaying the primary election. Things are only going to get worse the next 2 months. Our democracy may be the one thing more important than the pandemic. They better find a way to let everybody that was going to vote an opportunity. And fast.

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2 hours ago, richNcincy said:

Please be mindful of your posts within this thread.  It has been unlocked so that we can share updates and keep each other informed.  This is not the place for bashing or spreading blatant inaccurate information. If the rules are not being followed, we will lock/delete the thread entirely.

Thanks for re-opening the thread. But if rules are not followed, could the individual rule breakers suffer the punishment, rather than closing and deleting the thread and punishing everyone? I just do not get the collective punishment thing. This is a very important topic and to lock or delete it because of bashing or spreading of inaccurate info by a few(or trolls who only want to get the thread closed/deleted)would be a real shame. If needed, why not just ban rule breakers from the thread?

 

I look to this thread because it is on a good site with good moderation-unlike most other sites and all of social media which is a complete mess.

 

 

Thanks again.

Edited by Toddguy
spelling, grammar, etc.-the usual

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2 hours ago, Boomerang_Brian said:

My mother-in-law has “bronchitis” (her words).  Her doctor and daughters made it clear she needed to go get tested for Coronavirus. They drove down to Cleveland Clinic main campus yesterday. They arrived at 3:30. They were turned away because there were already too many people in line. They are going again today and plan to arrive two hours before testing starts. I will update when I know more. 

2nd testing site should be operational at Landerhaven.  Check local news or clevelandclinic.org uhhospitals.org to verify.

 

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1 hour ago, seicer said:

 

And if and when the tests arrive, folks can easily get a drive-through swab and results within minutes. It's a lot better than going to the one medical center that may be in your community (and many are without such facilities). If properly executed and staffed, that's 16,400 locations across the nation. (This is absent of the politics around our botched testing of COVID, and the downplaying of the severity of the issue.) You sound like you are complaining about a bi-partisan, unique solution when you offer up nothing better.

 

By the way, South Korea and China both had widespread use of drive-through testing facilities on parking lots nationwide, many on store lots.

 

Spare me with your assumptions about political leanings. 

The largest issue is that there is still not widespread testing, our nation is behind, and we did not go on the offensive with testing in the ways that South Korea did. I have no issue with partnership with the private sector, but it doesn't change the reality of our current situation. At least these CEOs are good corporate citizens, though, right? By the way, the link you posted doesn't mention "results within minutes," but it does praise how these various corporations stand to gain and promote their individual health brands. Good for them.

 

I've got two friends hunkered down in Daegu who have been able to get tested and have had masks, gloves, and other supplies made readily available due to the government working with the private sector. Despite being in one of the hardest hit outbreak areas, they're feeling rather confident and hopeful. 

 

Here in the US at the fed level... at least the Target CEO got to mention his brand from the Rose Garden.  

 

Thankfully, Ohio has been further ahead than most in taking proactive steps. 

 

Edit: Just heard from friends who have been waiting in line at the Cleveland Clinic since this morning.

 

To summarize, I appreciate and will be grateful when drive-thru testing is available in more places and widespread. However, we're still behind and have a nation that's growing ever more anxious no matter how many CEOs approach the podium and tell us about their "little clinic" brands. 

Edited by Gordon Bombay

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1 hour ago, Gordon Bombay said:


Yes. How nice of them to donate part of their parking lots for drive-thru testing that a vast majority of the nation still doesn’t have. 

Not everyone should be tested. The vast majority of people should not be tested. If everyone was tested it could make things worse because it could create a sense of comfort that they dont have the disease and likely wont get it. Did we need better testing that was more available earlier, yes, but we do not want everyone getting tested. 

 

Also, even if there were tests available for everyone, it is not like it does not take human lab techs to process them. The system was never equipped to handle that. 

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Trump just spelled out "H-I-P-P-A" "H-I-P-A-A" letter by letter, confirming he's never come across it in his life.  Literally everyone else says "hippa" "hipaa" as a word.

 

EDIT - I am bad at transcribing!

Edited by DarkandStormy

Very Stable Genius

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1 minute ago, DarkandStormy said:

Trump just spelled out "H-I-P-P-A" letter by letter, confirming he's never come across it in his life.  Literally everyone else says "hippa" as a word.

 

Yes, but he also spoke with McDonalds and Wendys and they're tremendous. Spicy nuggets will get us through this. 

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Metrohealth just announced they are beginning the third testing site in Cleveland with results in 2 hours or less. The Cleveland metro area is the most prepared in the country.

Edited by Clefan98

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We just got our first testing site set up (drive-through) by our local hospital, but we do not need to test everyone at this point because most labs are at capacity. They expedited the implementation of the drive-through testing site by several weeks, but results are expected to come back within two to three days. It still requires a doctor's order to get a test.

 

Meanwhile, there is a large tent going up on our Wal-Mart lot and I just received a notification that our local Walgreens will soon offer drive-through testing.

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“It’s the undocumented infections which are driving the spread of the outbreak,” said co-author Jeffrey Shaman of Columbia University Mailman School, according to GeekWire.

 

 

25 minutes ago, DarkandStormy said:

Trump just spelled out "H-I-P-P-A" letter by letter, confirming he's never come across it in his life.  Literally everyone else says "hippa" as a word.

 

 

ha! -- but just for the record it's hipaa:

 

The Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act of 1996, commonly known as HIPAA, is a series of regulatory standards that outline the lawful use and disclosure of protected health information (PHI). HIPAA compliance is regulated by the Department of Health and Human Services (HHS) and enforced by the Office for Civil Rights (OCR).

 

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29 minutes ago, DarkandStormy said:

Trump just spelled out "H-I-P-P-A" letter by letter, confirming he's never come across it in his life.  Literally everyone else says "hippa" as a word.

 

Its also not spelled that way... 

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I found today's featured article by the P-D interesting: Virus could live up to 24 hours on cardboard, 3 days on plastic and steel and it got me thinking why we don't use copper on frequently touched surfaces (e.g. tabletops, handles, door knobs, etc.) as it's great at reducing the spread of germs: Copper is great at killing superbugs – so why don’t hospitals use it?

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1 hour ago, Mendo said:

I don't get the point of delaying the primary election. Things are only going to get worse the next 2 months. Our democracy may be the one thing more important than the pandemic. They better find a way to let everybody that was going to vote an opportunity. And fast.


I support them delaying the election.
 

In person voting may not get any better, but because things moved so quickly (we had no cases 1 week ago!!!) people weren’t able to adequately adjust to the situation. Folks may have planned on voting in-person, as I prefer that myself. 
 

Health advice has evolved rapidly and made switching last minute to absentee ballots difficult for many people. This will give time for most folks, especially the vulnerable, to vote absentee.

 

Another note; I agree that this wasn’t handled the best, but I thought DeWine’s explanation made sense. He tried to go through the courts, because he felt they had the power to select another election date. A power he doesn’t have. When they decided to pass, he went with the other option which was postponing the election with no date set.

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3 minutes ago, seicer said:

I found today's featured article by the P-D interesting: Virus could live up to 24 hours on cardboard, 3 days on plastic and steel and it got me thinking why we don't use copper on frequently touched surfaces (e.g. tabletops, handles, door knobs, etc.) as it's great at reducing the spread of germs: Copper is great at killing superbugs – so why don’t hospitals use it?

 

Or how there's aluminum all over the place. Non-coated aluminum has zillions of pores to trap germs.

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40 minutes ago, Clefan98 said:

Metrohealth just announced they are beginning the third testing site in Cleveland with results in 2 hours or less. The Cleveland metro area is the most prepared in the country.

where's the second site?

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3 hours ago, seicer said:

 

So, Italy, with their failing healthcare system that's also overwhelmed? Iran? China?

 

We build hospitals for the capacity we need in most situations, with provisions for a few extra beds/ICU units for emergencies. No hospital in the world is equipped to deal with pandemics that overwhelms the entire medical system. Hospital beds/ICU units are very expensive to build and no government or private entity will build such a facility only to have the equipment remain idle and deteriorate.

 

One of the best things that's come out of this is that we've enabled private corporations to be the drivers of some of the testing facilities since they are more readily accessible than hospitals by sheer volume. Wal-Mart/Target/CVS/Walgreens are offering drive-through testing facilities (or will very soon) and there are plenty more of those locations than hospitals. The more we can test, the better.

I wasn't even talking about hospitals and beds.  I'm talking about the basics like testing, which we are lagging far behind in.   

 

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/03/17/us/coronavirus-testing-data.html

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22 minutes ago, seicer said:

I found today's featured article by the P-D interesting: Virus could live up to 24 hours on cardboard, 3 days on plastic and steel and it got me thinking why we don't use copper on frequently touched surfaces (e.g. tabletops, handles, door knobs, etc.) as it's great at reducing the spread of germs: Copper is great at killing superbugs – so why don’t hospitals use it?

 

 

I dk good question, but partly money i would guess --- copper is around $2.40/lb vs 0.13 cents/lb for aluminum.

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16 minutes ago, Pugu said:

where's the second site?

 

At UH Landerbrook Health Center in Mayfield Heights from 11 a.m. to 7 p.m seven days a week.

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^Thanks. Are both UH and Metro's testing sites drive thru services like the Clinic's?

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8 minutes ago, mrnyc said:

 

 

I dk good question, but partly money i would guess --- copper is around $2.40/lb vs 0.13 cents/lb for aluminum.

 

Yeah, I was going to say cost, but the long term cost to society would likely be less.  Good luck convincing people of this fact, though.

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Just now, Pugu said:

^Thanks. Are both UH and Metro's testing sites drive thru services like the Clinic's?

 

Yes.

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Apple and Google are each sitting on hoards of over $100 billion in cash.  They're going to become truly gigantic as they buy one shriveling business after another.  

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CNBC said they expect to see their first airline fatality by April 1 due to the outbreak. 

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^Oh. You didn't say major. But they were pretty big.

 

"Flybe provided more than half of UK domestic flights outside London...Flybe carried 8 million passengers a year between 56 airports in the UK and Europe, with over 210 routes across 15 countries. On 5 March 2020, Flybe filed for administration and ceased all operations. The airline, which had been struggling for several months, claimed that its difficulties were compounded by the impact of the coronavirus pandemic on bookings...."

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flybe

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we should not bail out airlines, casinos, cruise lines or any other large corporation. the only bail out should be for small business and employees.

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22 minutes ago, jam40jeff said:

 

Yeah, I was going to say cost, but the long term cost to society would likely be less.  Good luck convincing people of this fact, though.

 

That was the point of some of that article: "Cost could also be a factor. Hospitals may perceive hand-gel dispensers as cheaper options, despite the fact that these gels do not all kill all microbes – including the norovirus. Yet an independent study by University of York’s Health Economics Consortium has shown that, taking the reduced costs of shorter patient stay and treatment into consideration, the payback time for installing copper fittings is only two months."

So many places are so short-sighted in decision making. There is also a push by other hospitals to clean less thoroughly to reduce the growth of superbugs, but that's a movement that's even smaller than the use of copper.

Edited by seicer

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17 minutes ago, freefourur said:

we should not bail out airlines, casinos, cruise lines or any other large corporation. the only bail out should be for small business and employees.

 

If there's any bail out it needs to go to individual, qualifying American consumers (i.e. I should receive $0 as my industry is currently not affected).

 

Let the American people decide where the money goes. 

 

If an airline fails, the one that replaces it will be wiser with its money

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15 minutes ago, freefourur said:

we should not bail out airlines, casinos, cruise lines or any other large corporation. the only bail out should be for small business and employees.

 

 

231gmn.jpg

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2 minutes ago, YABO713 said:

 

If there's any bail out it needs to go to individual, qualifying American consumers (i.e. I should receive $0 as my industry is currently not affected).

 

Let the American people decide where the money goes. 

 

If an airline fails, the one that replaces it will be wiser with its money

At this point I would just send money to everyone and use tax returns to recover money from those unaffected. it would be easier ans faster to get the checks out. Perhaps the money should be paid monthly until the pandemic abates.

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13 minutes ago, DarkandStormy said:

 

They're saying 1.1 million Americans will die even with these measures? Am I reading that right?

That is the way I heard it when she said it. I did a double take for sure. About one out of every 300 people. If you take that and apply it worldwide(with the interventions) that would be about 25 million deaths. Without the interventions, worldwide it would be about 55-60 million deaths, the greatest mass death event in recorded human history surpassing the 1918 flu pandemic. *I think the second world war had a higher toll than that though.

 

*not saying it will be this bad, just extrapolating a bit.  Hopefully it will not have such high mortality rates?  And I know this sounds extreme, but I am just extrapolating from the data suggested by what Dr. Acton appeared to state.

Edited by Toddguy

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24 minutes ago, freefourur said:

does anyone have a daily case tracker for Ohio specifically?

 

I think we could work backwards in this thread probably.

 

3/17: 67

3/16: 50

3/15: 37

3/14: 26

3/13: 13 (or 14 depending on which outlet you believe)

3/12: 6

3/11: 3 (or maybe 4 - again, some hospitals were reporting cases that didn't seem to be in the "official" Ohio count)

 

DeWine and Acton said the #s would double every 6 days - it's doubling every two days the past four days, so...we also don't have an accurate count because we are just now getting testing up and running at higher levels.

Edited by DarkandStormy

Very Stable Genius

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Unless i'm having  total math brain fart it looks like the growth rate is decreasing in ohio.  I did a quick chart. maybe I'm not thinking it through correctly.

 


 

image.png

Edited by freefourur

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