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Cincinnati: Over-the-Rhine: Development and News (non-3CDC)

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Actually the old-school furniture stores are still hanging on because their customers vastly outnumber those going to Ikea and other chains and are intensely loyal.  Looks like these guys saw they could get well over $1 million for their building and decided to cash out. 

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Interesting, hopefully this means the windows can be reopened again.

 

I'm wondering also what can go in that space? It's rather large, and contains 2 stories.

 

A part of me would think Elm and Iron would be interested in opening up a 3rd location by Findley Market/Rheingeist for those who doesn't frequent OTR South as much.

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It's probably going to get gobbled up by Model Group and incorporated into Phase 2 of Market Square, which already includes most of the buildings on the west side of Elm. Ground floor retail + office or apts. above.

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Downtown Detroit was pretty much *completely* abandoned in the late 1990s, which was definitely not the case in Cincinnati.  I went to Tiger Stadium the first time the Reds played there for interleague play in 1999 or thereabouts and we took a lap through downtown Detroit.  It was abandoned beyond belief, with old paperwork flying out of busted-out 25th-floor windows of old skyscrapers. 

 

 

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Downtown Detroit was pretty much *completely* abandoned in the late 1990s, which was definitely not the case in Cincinnati.  I went to Tiger Stadium the first time the Reds played there for interleague play in 1999 or thereabouts and we took a lap through downtown Detroit.  It was abandoned beyond belief, with old paperwork flying out of busted-out 25th-floor windows of old skyscrapers. 

 

 

1999 was my heyday in downtown Detroit! Good times.

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Park+Vine will close on January 15.

 

While I'm sure that some people on this forum will overreact and say this is a sign Main Street is dying, the news of Park+Vine's closure does not shock me. Park+Vine was one of the first businesses to open in the "Gateway Quarter" and helped draw people into the neighborhood, but I think Dan probably believes he accomplished the goals he set out to accomplish, and is ready to move on to something new. I wouldn't be surprised if he eventually opens a variant of a Park+Vine in another emerging neighborhood in Cincinnati.

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Park+Vine will close on January 15.

 

While I'm sure that some people on this forum will overreact and say this is a sign Main Street is dying, the news of Park+Vine's closure does not shock me. Park+Vine was one of the first businesses to open in the "Gateway Quarter" and helped draw people into the neighborhood, but I think Dan probably believes he accomplished the goals he set out to accomplish, and is ready to move on to something new. I wouldn't be surprised if he eventually opens a variant of a Park+Vine in another emerging neighborhood in Cincinnati.

 

From their news release- "Korman said Park + Vine saw sales gains in 2016, with an increase of 10% compared to 2015. In all, the retailer is seeing its best sales in 2016."

 

Seems like you'd be able to sell the store as a going concern rather than close it.

 

 

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Park+Vine will close on January 15.

 

While I'm sure that some people on this forum will overreact and say this is a sign Main Street is dying, the news of Park+Vine's closure does not shock me. Park+Vine was one of the first businesses to open in the "Gateway Quarter" and helped draw people into the neighborhood, but I think Dan probably believes he accomplished the goals he set out to accomplish, and is ready to move on to something new. I wouldn't be surprised if he eventually opens a variant of a Park+Vine in another emerging neighborhood in Cincinnati.

 

From their news release- "Korman said Park + Vine saw sales gains in 2016, with an increase of 10% compared to 2015. In all, the retailer is seeing its best sales in 2016."

 

Seems like you'd be able to sell the store as a going concern rather than close it.

 

Just because the sales volume increased does not mean it was a profitable business. Even if it was, rising rents could have deterred potential buyers. It was a wonderful staple of the neighborhood but my guess is that any interested buyer would have to take it on as a labor of love. Perhaps Korman did not have an appropriate successor and does not want his brand sullied by a "lesser" operator or perhaps he is looking to replicate the concept in a new neighborhood.

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3CDC expresses jealousy of the tenant mix at the Oakley Station development.

 

Actually...

"This past year we've really focused on getting those soft goods retail tenants," he said. "Swoon (an intimate apparel retailer) just opened, and we've got two more women's stores in the works. As far as restaurants go, in the beginning it wasn't as attractive an area, so we'd take any restaurants – as long as they're quality concepts and quality chefs. Now, it's who can we bring in to support our existing tenants, so it's a bit more strategic."

 

There is still a need for restaurants that serve breakfast, he said. Taste of Belgium is the big player in that realm. Palazzolo would like to see a more traditional diner in the neighborhood. There's still room for more ethnic food as well, he said, like Indian and Chinese restaurants. And on the side streets he'd like to see things like fitness or retail tenants to support the restaurants.

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Yeah, it's crazy that OTR doesn't have Indian food, Thai food, a 24/7 diner, a Cincinnati chili parlor, a grab-and-go sandwich place, etc. Those are the kinds of things that will make it feel like a real neighborhood instead of a nightlife/dining destination.

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Well, it did have a diner...


"You don't just walk into a bar and mix it up by calling a girl fat" - buildingcincinnati speaking about new forumers

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Yeah, it's crazy that OTR doesn't have Indian food, Thai food, a 24/7 diner, a Cincinnati chili parlor, a grab-and-go sandwich place, etc. Those are the kinds of things that will make it feel like a real neighborhood instead of a nightlife/dining destination.

 

In 20 years (give or take) it will.

 

If I head correctly the owner of the downtown skyline is still massively afraid of OTR and still thinks its a murderous ghetto, so there definitely is still a perception problem of OTR to this day.

 

I also think there is still an over saturated amount of Bars as well in OTR, and I feel like because it's the safe way to make alot of money in OTR. We definitely need more establishments like Gomez. Too much of OTR is defined by Fine Dining restaurants, or Bars. We need more Tuckers. We need more Gomez like locations spread throughout the side streets of OTR.

 

This is the short list of new establishments still to come in OTR...

 

-Revel (wine bar on E12th st)

-Genius (Bar on Republic St)

-Bullhead Creamery (Alcholic Ice Cream bar on Main St)

-Mecca (just recently opened on Walnut St)

-Long Fellow (Bar to open on Clay St)

 

Notice how they are all bars and not dining options or casual European style cafes.

 

I just get the sense that Bars make money in OTR, but food concepts are far more risky and thats why we see less of them in OTR.

 

 

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An interesting take on a Cincinnati chili parlor with beef, lamb, turkey, vegetarian versions of the chili etc would absolutely kill. Imagine what Senate does with hot dogs, except do that to Cincy Chili and it feels like a no-brainer. If it was open late night I would eat there about 52 times a year...

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^ Exactly, you can make a pot of chili and spaghetti big enough to feed 10 people for about $7 (or closer to $10 if you use lamb, or closer to $5 if it is veggie chili). I do it about once a month and then freeze it to eat for a few weeks. There's definitely some potential for this idea - it is a cool recipe to play around with.

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There is definitely not an over saturation of bars. They are usually packed, and I believe the rumor mill has been saying Neon's and maybe another could possibly close soon.

 

Just to add, I still think that the neighborhood could use a pedestrian only street with areas for dining like there are in Europe. Not sure how this would add to the diversity of offerings but still, I feel it's something that would benefit a lot of people.

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There is definitely not an over saturation of bars. They are usually packed, and I believe the rumor mill has been saying Neon's and maybe another could possibly close soon.

 

Just to add, I still think that the neighborhood could use a pedestrian only street with areas for dining like there are in Europe. Not sure how this would add to the diversity of offerings but still, I feel it's something that would benefit a lot of people.

 

The owner of Neons already chimed in another thread. He's moving Neon's to a different location in OTR...from what I understand a 3cdc owned spot.

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They are closing their current location. Have no immediate plans to reopen in another location, but have been evaluating options for a while.

 

From Neon's owner in the Cincy Bar thread...

 

We are in negotiations and have been working on an alternative location in OTR since 2013.  We hope to announce more on that very soon assuming we can wrap up a few final details

 

It sounds like they have a location in mind, and are close to announcing the new spot assuming they can get everything tied together.

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^Is that confirmed re: 4EG? I've been half joking about that for a while. I figure someone with money came in and offered the building owners more money, and 4EG seemed like a safe guess, but it was all speculation on my part.

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They have been linked to the old Grammer's site multiple times. Lots of tire kicking. 4EG is going to take over the old Neon's site.

 

I imagine that's hard to happen since the Wade Project seems to be dead, and I imagine rehabilitating the Grammer Bar building would cost quite a bit.

 

I think the Old Weilert Building with the beer garden in the back would be a much perfect suitor. Especially since 3cdc owns it, and is going to rehabilitate the building soon anyways (hopefully at least)/

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^I'd be surprised if they went to renting a large space for Neon's 3.0. I think they've been beaten down pretty good from not owning their bar that they wouldn't consider renting again unless conditions were just right, but idk.

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Does someone have the rights to the name "Neon's?" If they moved to a new location - would they keep that name or would that confuse customers? Maybe they could go with "Argon's" or one of the other noble gases? Or "Halogen's" if they want to stick with the lighting concept.

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Does someone have the rights to the name "Neon's?" If they moved to a new location - would they keep that name or would that confuse customers? Maybe they could go with "Argon's" or one of the other noble gases? Or "Halogen's" if they want to stick with the lighting concept.

 

Fluorescent's. Where every space is uncomfortably over-lit with crappy fluorescent tubes and carries the quality of a mid 80s laundromat that can barely stay afloat.

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Neon's can't move its vibe combined with its physical space make it what it is.  It's going to be finished and it's so sad.  4EG taking over that space makes me really sad. 

 

A bar called Neon's in another location is just a new bar by the same owners.  They can call it Neon's but it won't be.  :cry:

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What made Neons popular was it's outdoor patio.  The bar itself inside is nothing special and would always be way to crowded when it's cold since the space was so small.  I'm sure someone will take the space and setup a similar bar that will be super popular in the nice months and less popular when it's cold.  The owners of Neons should definitely move somewhere else in OTR because in no way are there too many bars in the area, there aren't nearly enough.  More and more people are moving and/or going out there with every passing year so we're not even close to hitting an over saturation of bars. 

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Has anyone heard about the planning commission meeting today for the Liberty/Elm project?

 

Just heard it was approved.

 

margyartgrrl's avatar

Margy Waller

margyartgrrl[/member]

#PlanningCommission approved with 1 dissent from @prostreetcar stay tuned for next steps. It’s not over at all. #savingplaces #ElmLiberty

 


“All truly great thoughts are conceived while walking.”
-Friedrich Nietzsche

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Look inside Towne Properties' new Elm Street project in OTR

 

towneelm01*750xx832-468-0-0.jpg

 

Towne Properties has completed new townhomes in the 1500 block of Over-the-Rhine, its first major project in the historic neighborhood.

 

Towne’s seven-home project along the Cincinnati Bell Connector streetcar line, adjacent to Washington Park, was announced for the half-acre site in June 2015.

 

More below:

http://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2016/12/02/look-inside-towne-properties-new-elm-street.html


"You don't just walk into a bar and mix it up by calling a girl fat" - buildingcincinnati speaking about new forumers

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Large OTR project near Findlay Market gets final approval after lengthy dispute

 

A contentious fight over a major new mixed-use development near Findlay Market at Liberty and Elm streets ended with the Cincinnati Planning Commission siding with developer Source 3 and approving its final development plan on a 4-1 vote after a marathon, six-and-a-half hour meeting on Friday.

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