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Cincinnati: Downtown: 1010 On The Rhine / Downtown Kroger

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^Just curious here, would people be opposed to the Davis Furniture building coming down if someone managed to assemble that entire parcel and had an actual plan other than Joseph-ing it for more parking spaces?

 

The general consensus from most people I've talked to is that they'd be okay with the Davis Furniture building coming down if that entire block (including the Salvation Army building and two large surface parking lots) were redeveloped as part of some large new development. The opposition to demolishing the Davis was mostly due to the fact that Stough Group wanted to make it into a parking lot for their Hanke Exchange development across the street.

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There is a parking garage and a sea of surface lots right behind the Hanke building.  Not to mention street parking on Main.  Why in the world would they need parking across the street from them? 

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I have to imagine is that most people who visit/work in OTR/CBD are still mostly tourists. They all live up in the suburbs still. Cincinnati is still not considered a desirable place to live compared to the suburbs, yet, at least. An, the city is still not seen as a glamours place like Chicago/NYC/LA/Miami, it's just considered, simply, "downtown"

 

It will eventually change though as OTR continues to gentrify/the cbd continues to see more positive development like the kroger. The biggest shift will be this generation who are currently in middle school/highschool. This gen y group is very tired of the suburbs.

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Because Cincinnatians will never miss an opportunity to freak out about parking.

 

I got in an argument with someone else on a different website about this. He was saying that the type of people who frequent Rhinegeist have "no problem walking 1.75 miles from Rhinegeist to GABP" and couldn't accept the fact that if this was true, most everyone in the CBD would just park at the Banks and we wouldn't be building all these additional garages all over OTR and elsewhere. Never mind the fact that "the type of people who frequent Rhinegeist" probably would Uber to Vine Street rather than walk, even in broad daylight.


“To an Ohio resident - wherever he lives - some other part of his state seems unreal.”

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^Just curious here, would people be opposed to the Davis Furniture building coming down if someone managed to assemble that entire parcel and had an actual plan other than Joseph-ing it for more parking spaces?

 

I would be. In fact I think the main value of the Davis building is setting the (fine) granularity of that block. Granularity may sound like a a nerd-term but it is why OTR feels more vibrant than the CBD and why OTR attracts more entrepreneurs and small developers. It is also what makes the coursely-grained CBD fragile and brittle to huge dead spots when a building goes vacant or otherwise fails to create activity with a variety of uses. https://cincinnatiideas.com/2017/02/07/historic-preservation-a-link-to-a-different-kind-of-economy/


www.cincinnatiideas.com

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probably would Uber to Vine Street rather than walk, even in broad daylight.

 

They do.  People take Uber from Rhinegeist to Taft's and vice-verse, despite the existence of a streetcar that directly connects the two. 

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This conversation probably belongs in the streetcar thread, but the city should really post giant signs at each stop that say something to the effect of “Why Uber when you can get to X, Y, and Z bar for $1?”


“To an Ohio resident - wherever he lives - some other part of his state seems unreal.”

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^ I've taken Uber from destinations on the streetcar route when in groups of ~4 because a the cost of the Uber ride is comparable to streetcar tickets. If we followed KC's model and just made it free, people would have no excuse not to take the streetcar instead, and most would. I'd normally take the streetcar and bring everyone along, but that's just because I actively want to ride the streetcar because it's more comfortable and enjoyable than being in some random person's car.

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The Hanke building has a direct entrance from the A&D garage, however due to agreements with the courthouse, Job & Family Services, and county administration, it's very hard to get in.  Daily parking is used up by 8:30 am at the latest and it doesn't usually free up until after lunch, plus monthly slots are next to impossible to obtain.  The real crime is that it's a complete ghost town after 5:00 pm, and the sea of ugly parking lots between Sycamore and Broadway kill the connection between OTR proper and Pendleton. 

 

I wouldn't necessarily be opposed to losing Davis for a singular building, though I think an easier sell would be a 7+ story block facing Central Parkway and something just a bit smaller behind.  Even Emory doesn't go all the way to 12th. 

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This conversation probably belongs in the streetcar thread, but the city should really post giant signs at each stop that say something to the effect of Why Uber when you can get to X, Y, and Z bar for $1?

'

Uber can get you there quicker.

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Uber can get you there quicker.

 

Once you're in the car, perhaps.  But the car often takes 10 minutes to get to a location, even downtown.  A car merely on the other side of the same block can catch two red lights, then there can be confusion over which car is the car.  Or the people request the ride but then refuse to come out and get in the damn thing. 

 

Also, in Cranleyworld, an uber can trip a red light to turn green, but not the streetcar. 

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I love your drone pics taestell[/member] !

 

Same! at this point they're starting to work on putting together stuff to pour the fifth floor, I think.

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Kroger CEO updates downtown store progress

By Steve Watkins  – Staff Reporter, Cincinnati Business Courier

47 minutes ago

 

Kroger Co. CEO Rodney McMullen already has a few plans for the company’s new downtown store when it opens.

 

“The thing I think will be so cool about it is it’ll be nice to have a store right next to where your office is,” McMullen said after Kroger’s (NYSE: KR) annual shareholders meeting on Thursday. “You can test stuff from it. I’m sure the store director there may get more help than he or she wants.”

 

https://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/news/2018/06/28/kroger-ceo-updates-downtown-store-progress.html

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I wonder who owns that adjacent lot across from the new Kroger tower with the Charlie’s Harper mural. Would love to see that one get redeveloped at some point as well.

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I wonder who owns that adjacent lot across from the new Kroger tower with the Charlie’s Harper mural. Would love to see that one get redeveloped at some point as well.

 

Looks like it is big enough for the 3CDC special (retail, garage, apartment tower).  I'd assume they're already trying to get it. 

 

Interesting article I found regarding that location:

https://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/blog/2013/04/downtown-developer-sells-walnut-street.html

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The fact that what isn't a landmark? All of Court St? There is a Court St. historic district, which is why 3CDC had to get approval from the HCB before renovating the structures on the northside of Court.

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It would be cool if someone did a City Flea-type thing in the median on Court. Like on Westerstraat in Amsterdam:

 

131020-17-westerstraat.jpg

Amsterdam_175.JPG

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Agree. The City Flea would be great there. It would at least give the grass at Washington Park some much needed time to recuperate.

 

Another thing is that City Flea type events can be great ways to entice people into a revitalizing area. The fact that it has stayed in Washington Park so long shows that they are not interested in using it as an opportunity to catalyze interest in other parts of the core, like Court Street, where the demand drivers are needed to spark interest and momentum.


“All truly great thoughts are conceived while walking.”
-Friedrich Nietzsche

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The fact that what isn't a landmark? All of Court St? There is a Court St. historic district, which is why 3CDC had to get approval from the HCB before renovating the structures on the northside of Court.

 

I think they mean a landmark in the general sense. A place people flock to, take pictures of, associate with the city.

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If 3CDC is interested in letting the grass at Washington Park heal, they need to have an entire season with no events. It turns into a giant mud pit by June every year. Move CityFlea to Court Street one year and use the grass as an excuse.

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The fact that what isn't a landmark? All of Court St? There is a Court St. historic district, which is why 3CDC had to get approval from the HCB before renovating the structures on the northside of Court.

 

I think they mean a landmark in the general sense. A place people flock to, take pictures of, associate with the city.

 

That's exactly what I meant.  There might have been an early 90s attempt to make a marketplace there (much earlier there was an actual market in the middle of the street) but it seems to have vanished without a trace other than those obviously early 90s signs.

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Why would Court St. be a landmark when OTR is a block away? Court is somewhat interesting for its median and parking arrangement, and there are some nice historic buildings along the street (hence the historic district) but I don’t really see what it so unique or special about it. The whole NW part of downtown has similar buildings too.

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I unfortunately think the just need to astroturf the lawn at Washington Park. Not using the area for the sake of the grass would just lead to a great public space being underutilized. And the current mud/dirt pit is a worse situation than having astroturf.

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Why would Court St. be a landmark when OTR is a block away? Court is somewhat interesting for its median and parking arrangement, and there are some nice historic buildings along the street (hence the historic district) but I don’t really see what it so unique or special about it. The whole NW part of downtown has similar buildings too.

 

Why can't it be both? I like Court Street and many of those buildings have historic value. The street itself could become a destination with the right investment. Both Head House Square and South Street in Philly are destinations in their own right and are right next to each other. Court Street reminds me of HH Square and could similarly host a market house in the center if you removed the parking:

 

https://goo.gl/maps/v9JkBQt6eQu

 

EDIT: I would imagine that the market house in HH Square is similar to what existed at one point on Court Street.

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Well, we could put back the center market house that used to be there historically. Make it into something that doesn't quite compete with Findlay Market, but has a similar type of layout with booths for up-and-coming food vendors and other types of retail. But I'm sure some Cincinnatians would complain about the loss of a couple of parallel parking spaces.

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I unfortunately think the just need to astroturf the lawn at Washington Park. Not using the area for the sake of the grass would just lead to a great public space being underutilized. And the current mud/dirt pit is a worse situation than having astroturf.

 

They attempted to install a turf base with real grass poking through but this has failed to work as planned. What they have now is a thin sandy layer on top of artificial turf, so the turf can't be seen and is matted down not fluffed up as it should be. This thin sandy soil layer is too hot and thin for new grass to germinate which is why the condition is only getting worse.

 

I've heard they plan to rip everything out this winter and start from scratch next spring with only real grass, no artificial layer.

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If 3CDC is interested in letting the grass at Washington Park heal, they need to have an entire season with no events. It turns into a giant mud pit by June every year. Move CityFlea to Court Street one year and use the grass as an excuse.

The other event that causes heavy damage is the kickball games.  They really ruin the grass.

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As long as you want it to actually be used by people you just have to accept that it'll look really nice for about two weeks every spring before it begins to become destroyed. I don't see it as a huge issue. It's a community park and the community is getting a lot of use out of it.

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I haven't seen too many photos of the building. Has steel construction started yet? I believe the garage portion was just about complete when I saw it at the beginning of September, so I would imagine they have a floor or two of steel by now. The Downtown Kroger instagram appears to have been abandoned. 

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On 10/22/2018 at 2:14 PM, edale said:

I haven't seen too many photos of the building. Has steel construction started yet? I believe the garage portion was just about complete when I saw it at the beginning of September, so I would imagine they have a floor or two of steel by now. The Downtown Kroger instagram appears to have been abandoned. 

 

they're still doing the concrete. They're currently working on the tenth floor. So I'd imagine it's soon!

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^ I appreciate the update. It'd be great to get more photo updates of some of the larger projects getting built around town. If this was going up in Cleveland, we'd have a solid 3 pages devoted to just pictures of the damn crane being assembled lol. 

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Just now, edale said:

^ I appreciate the update. It'd be great to get more photo updates of some of the larger projects getting built around town. If this was going up in Cleveland, we'd have a solid 3 pages devoted to just pictures of the damn crane being assembled lol. 

 I was thinking about doing a every other week photo updated major projects around Cincy . Would it be more useful to maybe create a separate section for just construction photos?

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Why are there way more Cleveland-ers on this forum? I always found it strange that it’s hugely disproportionate compared to Columbus and Cincy. 

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47 minutes ago, Ucgrad2015 said:

 I was thinking about doing a every other week photo updated major projects around Cincy . Would it be more useful to maybe create a separate section for just construction photos?

 

I'd very much appreciate this! 

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1 hour ago, Ucgrad2015 said:

 I was thinking about doing a every other week photo updated major projects around Cincy . Would it be more useful to maybe create a separate section for just construction photos?

Just my opinion, but I think it makes most sense to put the photos in each of their respective threads... makes it easier in the future to see the "history" of a project by scrolling back through the thread. 

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