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Cincinnati: Downtown: 1010 On The Rhine / Downtown Kroger

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31 minutes ago, jjakucyk said:

When you look at it from the ground, the massive parking garage dwarfs the apartments that sit above it, which look like they only have 8-foot ceilings in comparison.  Nothing is too good for cars, so the budget is cut on everything else.

 

How much more does it cost to build an apartment building of this type with 9-foot ceilings?  Material costs can't be that much higher and I assume that labor costs are the exact same.  I imagine that heating/cooling is slightly more expensive since the volume to be conditioned is roughly 10% greater and since heat rises it might require more than 10% more heat to achieve the same temp in the lower half of each apartment.    

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It’s a lot more than you would think to increase floor to floor heights. One thing to keep in mind is that almost all building materials are modular 8’ sizes, so anything above that from 10’ studs to drywall and concrete forms all add up. Multiply that times many floors and it’s a huge difference, we once reduced a floor to floor height on new construction by 7” on a four story building and it saved around half a million (granted it had large floor plates).

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When value engineering gets involved it all goes down the toilet.  Garages are already about as no-frills as they can get, but they're still fantastically expensive compared to the rest of the building.  Shaving off that last 5% of the budget (or even less) takes not only a ton of work to achieve design and selection-wise, but that's also where a decent building gets turned into a complete turd sandwich.  That's why I'm excited to see how 8th and Main turns out.  It's not cheap construction (post-tensioned concrete), but there's no ramps or other shenanigans, so it's a simple and repeatable floor plate.  

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15 minutes ago, GCrites80s said:

I'm not 10 feet tall; what good do high ceilings do for me? They make the bills higher and lights suck to change.

 

Oh I think ceiling height makes a huge difference in whether or not a place feels cramped. I went from a 450 sq. ft. apartment with very low ceilings (basement level unit) to an apartment that was about 550 sq. ft. with very tall ceilings, and the unit felt twice as big. 

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2 hours ago, ucgrady said:

It’s a lot more than you would think to increase floor to floor heights. One thing to keep in mind is that almost all building materials are modular 8’ sizes, so anything above that from 10’ studs to drywall and concrete forms all add up. Multiply that times many floors and it’s a huge difference, we once reduced a floor to floor height on new construction by 7” on a four story building and it saved around half a million (granted it had large floor plates).

 

By saved, you mean the developer made $500k more. 

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Perhaps, but it's also just as likely to be something along the lines of "either cut $500K out of the budget or the project is dead."  Whether that's because the financing isn't available, or the units won't sell/rent, it could be any number of things.  "Hurr durr greed" is the knee-jerk response, but in a competitive market fractions of a percent matter, unfortunately.  

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22 minutes ago, jjakucyk said:

It's based on total volume, so going from 8' to 9' ceilings would be a 12.5% increase. 

 

Incidentally, the guys who replace your AC/furnace like to scam you buy getting you to buy a larger unit than what you need.  At least with a new home you have time to make sure they aren't getting you, but when your heating/cooling go out, they easily cajole people into buying something to-day without doing research. 

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It's easy enough to just replace the unit with one of the same size without running any calculations.  If the homeowner says it worked fine before, why change things up?  When I was in high school the furnace for our family room and master suite developed a crack in the heat exchanger, and they replaced it with a much smaller one.  They said the one that was installed when the addition was built was way oversized.  So you get honest ones too. 

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12 minutes ago, jjakucyk said:

It's easy enough to just replace the unit with one of the same size without running any calculations.  If the homeowner says it worked fine before, why change things up?  When I was in high school the furnace for our family room and master suite developed a crack in the heat exchanger, and they replaced it with a much smaller one.  They said the one that was installed when the addition was built was way oversized.  So you get honest ones too. 

 

The problem is when these guys come to the house it's not like they can install three different models so you can compare them.  You have to take their word on everything - for example how loud a particular AC unit might be compared to the old one.  

 

Speaking of loud HVAC -- what's up with the stuff on the roof of Children's?  It's easily the loudest building in the city.  

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8 minutes ago, jmecklenborg said:

 

The problem is when these guys come to the house it's not like they can install three different models so you can compare them.  You have to take their word on everything - for example how loud a particular AC unit might be compared to the old one.  

 

Speaking of loud HVAC -- what's up with the stuff on the roof of Children's?  It's easily the loudest building in the city.  

 

They are doing alot of air changes.

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^^ Yep, my company is still getting things to make for them and the deadline is making me very nervous. Crazy how many things are left to the last minute in the retail world and construction in general.

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Hopefully this is a big traffic generator for court street. 

 

It's still so awkward to walk along court street on a saturday afternoon and see it be a complete ghost town. You might run into a few rambling homeless people that are yelling to themselves in the alleyways, but pedestrians are scarce. 

 

I know its been mentioned alot here, but Court Street has such potential as a commercial strip and have a flurry of pedestrian activity. It's a shame the city was so broke for so long that court street was so neglected for so many decades. 

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5 hours ago, jjakucyk said:

 

Seems a grocery store can have a lot of stuff that's not quite ready and still be open.  They move cases and shelves and redo floors all while the store is still open anyway.

 

 

 

True, on remodel stores the shoppers have no worries walking under ladders and around tape to get their products so we try to do this at night as much as possible to stay out of their way.

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111783732_1010RhinePricing.thumb.PNG.e0d1f456777cabbe4ee6aba9a0d16216.PNG

 

Just received pricing info for the new units. Is it just me or does $1400/month seem super expensive for a 628 SF studio?

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These aren’t that outrageous but are a bit high in my opinion. I’d like to see the studios start at $1200 and the others to be $200-$300 less. 

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These are priced around $2.25/sf/month which is more or less bottom of the range possible in new construction mid/high rise buildings. So it seems they're pretty well priced given that any lower and the building wouldn't have been built.

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Definitely agree that 1010 is a better location. Plus, you can go to a Kroger without even going outdoors. But Encore has better appliances, better finishes, better amenities, and better spatial layouts in the units. Both complexes are too rich for my blood, but if I had to choose it would honestly be a toss-up between the two. Perhaps I am just underestimating the demand among the younger folks with high-paying jobs. 

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On 8/12/2019 at 11:17 AM, Largue said:

1824359784_Studio(A1).thumb.jpg.8ed3acc461ac92fd83d8d6584e980e07.jpg

 

This floor plan was just released. Still inquiring about pricing info...

 

I really like how they have the mechanical area open out to the hallway instead of the living area, that is a genius idea for better using space.

 

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1 hour ago, SWOH said:

 

I really like how they have the mechanical area open out to the hallway instead of the living area, that is a genius idea for better using space.

 

 

^ I'm pretty sure Encore is like that as well. North American Properties seems to be heading that direction, so I wouldn't be surprised if 8th & Main is the same.

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That's one of those things that you wonder how they didn't think of it sooner. I guess putting it in the middle was left over from the "Nyah, the dame will be home all day to let the furnace man in, see?" days that are long over with.

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12 hours ago, GCrites80s said:

That's one of those things that you wonder how they didn't think of it sooner. I guess putting it in the middle was left over from the "Nyah, the dame will be home all day to let the furnace man in, see?" days that are long over with.

I know in some places (like here in NYC) you can't have penetrations in your egress corridor for anything other than egress as of right. They'll occasionally let things like maintenance closets, mechanical rooms, etc. to open into the corridors if you can prove there really isn't an economical/viable way of doing it differently, but they are likely to give you an objection and force you to redo your plans if you present them something like this.

 

The reason being that mechanical rooms are some of the most likely places to cause a fire other than kitchens and having a door, even fire rated, opening straight into your egress path is counterintuitive. Granted, with sprinklers and fire rated door construction these days it's really NOT an issue, but the code in many places hasn't really kept up with reality.

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I also think the hallway would look cluttered with twice as many doors.

 

But I would rather have it in the hallway as a resident. It would be nice if you had to have maintenance fix something, they might not have to come into your apartment. They can just service it from the hallway.

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I've seen this done with plumbing as well, where the PEX manifold is accessed through the hallway so if someones toilet or tub or sink is overflowing and they aren't home someone can turn it off from the hallway. All the individual lines are labeled to make it easy for maintenance.

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20 hours ago, SWOH said:

I really like how they have the mechanical area open out to the hallway instead of the living area, that is a genius idea for better using space.

 

It's also really annoying when you have a door within your unit that's locked and you can't access it. Like when things roll into the crack underneath the door and you have to wait for maintenance to retrieve it. Or when curious cats shove their paws underneath and pull out dusty bug carcasses. I definitely prefer the hallway access. Another big advantage is that the corridor access would make the mechanical equipment virtually silent from within the unit.

 

16 hours ago, jmecklenborg said:

So does the bedroom wall go all the way to the ceiling, or are you in darkness?


Pretty sure it goes all the way to the ceiling. Seems like they classify it as a studio because there's no window in the bedroom. Not an ideal layout for people like me who struggle getting up without the help of daylight. 

Edited by Largue

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38 minutes ago, Largue said:

Pretty sure it goes all the way to the ceiling. Seems like they classify it as a studio because there's no window in the bedroom. Not an ideal layout for people like me who struggle getting up without the help of daylight. 

 

Think of all of the poor cats and dogs that will be cooped up in this building.  Hour after hour after hour of staring out the window.  

 

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35 minutes ago, jmecklenborg said:

 

Think of all of the poor cats and dogs that will be cooped up in this building.  Hour after hour after hour of staring out the window.  

 

 

But the owners will spend 10K a year on the dog which the dog won't notice. The dog will think about how they are in a tiny apartment by themselves 10 hours a day though wishing it belonged to a farmer that spends $200 a year on it.

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29 minutes ago, GCrites80s said:

 

But the owners will spend 10K a year on the dog which the dog won't notice. The dog will think about how they are in a tiny apartment by themselves 10 hours a day though wishing it belonged to a farmer that spends $200 a year on it.

 

Well if they work downtown at least they can go home at lunch to take the dog out to poop in the Central Parkway median.  

 

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