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2 minutes ago, freefourur said:

 

 

Where would Donnie be in life if not for his daddy? My guess selling used cars and one of those buy her pay here lots. 

 

He doesn't know enough about cars to do that.

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Fair enough, but how long do you hold out in order to achieve that result? Would you open it today for that deal or are you willing to wait say 6 months to get it for nothing?

Also, you get the government open and the Dream Act today. If you just get the government open, you don't get the Dream Act.

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2 minutes ago, Brutus_buckeye said:

Fair enough, but how long do you hold out in order to achieve that result? Would you open it today for that deal or are you willing to wait say 6 months to get it for nothing?

Also, you get the government open and the Dream Act today. If you just get the government open, you don't get the Dream Act.

Donnie is not offering the Dream Act and he backs out of deals when Ann Coulter yells at him.  I just wait until Mitch grows a set and pass a budget without the president. 

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6 minutes ago, freefourur said:

But he could've had the whole thing last year.  He is a terrible negotiator. 

 

Well, in order to negotiate effectively you have to have reasonable people with whom you can do that. Admittedly Trump, not being a seasoned politician, failed to anticipate the full depth and breadth of the Washington swamp beforehand. As ruthless as the real estate world is, I guess he might have actually believed he could transform the government but didn't fully  grasp the intractability of rigid martinets like Schumer and Pelosi, still bitter over Hillary's loss and unable to put the welfare of the country ahead of their narrow partisan agendas. 

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Just now, eastvillagedon said:

 

Well, in order to negotiate effectively you have to have reasonable people with whom you can do that. Admittedly Trump, not being a seasoned politician, failed to anticipate the full depth and breadth of the Washington swamp beforehand. As ruthless as the real estate world is, I guess he might have actually believed he could transform the government but didn't fully  grasp the intractability of rigid martinets like Schumer and Pelosi, still bitter over Hillary's loss and unable to put the welfare of the country ahead of their narrow partisan agendas. 

 

You must live in an alternate reality. But I guess that what Trumpies have been doing lately.  It's at the heart of the whole Q conspiracy theory.  They've created an alternate reality where Trump isn't a complete moron. 

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38 minutes ago, eastvillagedon said:

 

Well, in order to negotiate effectively you have to have reasonable people with whom you can do that. Admittedly Trump, not being a seasoned politician, failed to anticipate the full depth and breadth of the Washington swamp beforehand. As ruthless as the real estate world is, I guess he might have actually believed he could transform the government but didn't fully  grasp the intractability of rigid martinets like Schumer and Pelosi, still bitter over Hillary's loss and unable to put the welfare of the country ahead of their narrow partisan agendas. 

 

You should write for the Onion.  You wouldn't even have to make up stories, just give your personal views.  The parody writes itself. 

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1 hour ago, eastvillagedon said:

 

Well, in order to negotiate effectively you have to have reasonable people with whom you can do that. Admittedly Trump, not being a seasoned politician, failed to anticipate the full depth and breadth of the Washington swamp beforehand. As ruthless as the real estate world is, I guess he might have actually believed he could transform the government but didn't fully  grasp the intractability of rigid martinets like Schumer and Pelosi, still bitter over Hillary's loss and unable to put the welfare of the country ahead of their narrow partisan agendas. 

 

Is that his one and only mistake thus far, @eastvillagedon? Not anticipating how terrible other people are? 

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1 hour ago, eastvillagedon said:

 

Well, in order to negotiate effectively you have to have reasonable people with whom you can do that. Admittedly Trump, not being a seasoned politician, failed to anticipate the full depth and breadth of the Washington swamp beforehand. As ruthless as the real estate world is, I guess he might have actually believed he could transform the government but didn't fully  grasp the intractability of rigid martinets like Schumer and Pelosi, still bitter over Hillary's loss and unable to put the welfare of the country ahead of their narrow partisan agendas. 

 

He didn't take the full amount a year ago because he thought he could do *better* with a potentially Democratic house?  That makes total sense.

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1 hour ago, Brutus_buckeye said:

@freefourur  so quick question.

 

If you, being against the wall had the opportunity to give $25 Billion for the wall a year ago in exchange for the Dream Act, only to have the same opportunity a year later only for $20 billion less, would you take the deal to open the government?

 

Not sure if you're serious, but there was a US appeals court ruling in November that upheld DACA and largely took the pressure off of Congress to do something.  It now appears that DACA will survive through appeals alone.  So why would the Democrats give Trump a border wall in return for the restoration of the program that the court is in the process of restoring?  Trump made a mistake in 2018 by not accepting the original deal then he completely lost his leverage.

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I think the Democrats should introduce a bill in the House that includes $5B for a wall and a tax increase on short-term capital gains to pay for it.  Let the tax increase automatically expire once the $5B is raised.  That should satisfy both the don't-increase-the-deficit Republicans and the we-gotta-have-a-wall Republicans. 

 

If the President says he's going to veto it, then the Democrats can turn around with the message that they gave him what he wanted and he just says no -- he's a hostage-taker not a negotiator.  Then it will be up to Republicans to decide whether to stay in bed with the President on this or sit down and negotiate with the Democrats. 

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Shutdowns like this are going to keep happening and they're going to get longer. You have two basic political camps who are moving farther and farther apart in their definitions of reality (let alone the roles of government) until they won't even be able to agree that there is a role for the federal government anymore. The only exceptions may be for national defense or the freeflow of commerce over a larger geographic area than if the states or like-minded regions went at it alone.

 

Eventually, some states or regions are going to start picking up the fumbled federal ball and running with it themselves. They may do it piecemeal. Some may do it in big chunks. Others will be content to not offer former federally provided services and programs.

 

And that is how the USA will dissolve....by yielding and relegating authorities and responsibilities to more interested and functional parties until someone realizes that the old federal government no longer has a reason to exist. By then, few will care.

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5 hours ago, Hootenany said:

 

Not sure if you're serious, but there was a US appeals court ruling in November that upheld DACA and largely took the pressure off of Congress to do something.  It now appears that DACA will survive through appeals alone.  So why would the Democrats give Trump a border wall in return for the restoration of the program that the court is in the process of restoring?  Trump made a mistake in 2018 by not accepting the original deal then he completely lost his leverage.

The appeals decision can be overturned. Not all circuits have ruled on it.

Legislatively is a much stronger process to accomplish the goal and gives it more teeth. It is always better to get it legislatively as opposed to the courts for a multitude of reasons. So, the Dems have incentive to negotiate over this still.  Maybe not the same urgency where they were going to give $25 billion for anymore but still incentive to negotiate on the issue.

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On 1/15/2019 at 3:18 PM, jonoh81 said:

 

You should write for the Onion.  You wouldn't even have to make up stories, just give your personal views.  The parody writes itself. 

actually,  this story is more worthy of the Onion!  Wash Post--similar

 

An 87-year-old’s obituary said Trump ‘hastened’ her death. A local paper wouldn’t run it.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2019/01/16/an-year-olds-obituary-said-trump-hastened-her-death-local-paper-wouldnt-run-it/?utm_term=.bd889d616a53

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Good question. Then don't pay taxes. Keep filing extensions until Congress and Trump agree to reopen the government.

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36 minutes ago, KJP said:

 

 

Good question. Then don't pay taxes. Keep filing extensions until Congress and Trump agree to reopen the government.

 

Mehhhhh that won't fly in court lol

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1 hour ago, YABO713 said:

 

Mehhhhh that won't fly in court lol

 

You don't have to give a reason to request (and receive) a six-month extension. My mother once requested and received two extensions for the same tax year. Her lawyer wrote a letter explaining the reason (medical) for the second one. No other supporting documentation was required.

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10 minutes ago, KJP said:

 

You don't have to give a reason to request (and receive) a six-month extension. My mother once requested and received two extensions for the same tax year. Her lawyer wrote a letter explaining the reason (medical) for the second one. No other supporting documentation was required.

 

Oh yeah the extension, sure. 

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