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Cleveland: Downtown: Tower City / CityBlock Development

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It’s a dead issue either way. Maybe in its next makeover in another 20 years they can try that. But I agree. How can you offer discount merchandise with top rents?

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1 hour ago, MyTwoSense said:

We all have discussed that Tower City has sucked retail street life off the actual city streets.  The retailers and the Mall mgmt. were both negligent and had issues.  Examples were Gucci, LV and Joan & David.  I don't believe and outlet mall retailers, even the department store off shots like Saks off Fifth, with their lower overhead cost, can afford to be located in Tower City.

 

There are plenty of store fronts on West 6 or 9th.  I think a better space for outlet retailers would be the Euclid or Colonial arcades, with a mix of local retailers.

The Arcades are too small for modern retail space requirements in most cases. Outlet mall would never work there. (Which is one of the reasons I support the lakefront outlet mall *ducks*)

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Side note. 20 years ago there was a marked difference in prices from outlets to regular stores. I really don’t notice much difference in price nowadays. 

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3 hours ago, marty15 said:

Side note. 20 years ago there was a marked difference in prices from outlets to regular stores. I really don’t notice much difference in price nowadays. 

 

We're way off topic considering outlets aren't going into TC, but there is a bit difference in not just price, but quality and quantity of product. 

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13 hours ago, MyTwoSense said:

We all have discussed that Tower City has sucked retail street life off the actual city streets.  The retailers and the Mall mgmt. were both negligent and had issues.  Examples were Gucci, LV and Joan & David.  I don't believe and outlet mall retailers, even the department store off shots like Saks off Fifth, with their lower overhead cost, can afford to be located in Tower City.

 

There are plenty of store fronts on West 6 or 9th.  I think a better space for outlet retailers would be the Euclid or Colonial arcades, with a mix of local retailers.

 

Sadly though, most (though not all) casino patrons are the types that go strolling over to the warehouse district in search of retail.     

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On 6/28/2019 at 6:49 PM, KJP said:

 

Just speculating, but possibly just Starbucks, Dunkin Donuts, A Dollar, etc between the RTA rail station and Public Square. There may be a restaurant or two but it sounds like most of the retail will be along Prospect. I don't expect we'll get a lot of detail on Monday but I do hope the vision will be clarified further at that time. More detailed information will probably start to come out after Vocon does its work and leasing shakes out in the coming months.

So first, great to hear there will be SOME retail presence at Tower city. I believe making Prospect avenue the target was a brilliant idea, those storefronts have always been underutilized (I've never seen them occupied, if they have idk by who) as well as the street itself. 

 

Second, in the story you said upstairs (Public Square level) would maintain retail inside of Tower City, but you named stores that are downstairs, would they possibly shift them? Also (I know it's speculation) but do you think T-Mobile stays as it's a technology company that recently remodeled their space. 

 

THIRD the store fronts located by the Ritz Carlton on Prospect, they don't look very large at all, what could possibly go there? My only though would be they knock walls down and make it two moderately sized storefronts like an AT&T and or Microsoft Store. The former Hard Rock Cafe space, although it's on Huron would make a great retail space as well. Across the street where the old Houlihans was located would make the PERFECT Apple Store and would be very popular due to it's transit access, accessibility from inside the mall and overall Downtown population. I'm overall excited again for this project!

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One thing I will give the people behind this project is they are VERY ambitious. This type of project is definitely as risk and creating it in such a large space as Tower City to start is very gutsy but commendable. If you are going to do an ambitious project like this though you go hard or go home and they are definitely going hard. One thing I wish Cleveland did more often was I wish they "went for it all" with more of their projects, I wish their projects were things that got people outside of this board talking but they end up more conservative (The PHS Chandelier). The moniker of "world's largest __________" definitely is a headline grabber and will definitely catch peoples attention and draw interest. Combined with the type of space this project offers and its location as well as transit access it should be a home run. 

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10 minutes ago, MyPhoneDead said:

So first, great to hear there will be SOME retail presence at Tower city. I believe making Prospect avenue the target was a brilliant idea, those storefronts have always been underutilized (I've never seen them occupied, if they have idk by who) as well as the street itself. 

 

Second, in the story you said upstairs (Public Square level) would maintain retail inside of Tower City, but you named stores that are downstairs, would they possibly shift them? Also (I know it's speculation) but do you think T-Mobile stays as it's a technology company that recently remodeled their space. 

 

THIRD the store fronts located by the Ritz Carlton on Prospect, they don't look very large at all, what could possibly go there? My only though would be they knock walls down and make it two moderately sized storefronts like an AT&T and or Microsoft Store. The former Hard Rock Cafe space, although it's on Huron would make a great retail space as well. Across the street where the old Houlihans was located would make the PERFECT Apple Store and would be very popular due to it's transit access, accessibility from inside the mall and overall Downtown population. I'm overall excited again for this project!

Screen Shot 2019-06-30 at 8.21.30 AM.png

Screen Shot 2019-06-30 at 8.22.19 AM.png

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Do you remember when store fronts were in many of these building.  The last picture, with the UPS truck, that area housed my favorite store, Barney's.  There is a great deal off street frontage that can be retail on Prospect, Huron, W 2/3 street.

 

In the future, this would enable connected and continued retail going west on West 6 and East on Prospect.  This would deepen and enrich the connections that are currently in place making downtown more attractive to workers/employee, residents and visitors/tourist.

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1 minute ago, MyTwoSense said:

Do you remember when store fronts were in many of these building.  The last picture, with the UPS truck, that area housed my favorite store, Barney's.  There is a great deal off street frontage that can be retail on Prospect, Huron, W 2/3 street.

 

In the future, this would enable connected and continued retail going west on West 6 and East on Prospect.  This would deepen and enrich the connections that are currently in place making downtown more attractive to workers/employee, residents and visitors/tourist.

I don't I only remember Tower City interior as the retail area. What stores were in the storefronts of the second picture? I agree about the connection and that is why I love the choice to move stores to Prospect, it definitely bridges a gap from the WHD and East 4th Street. Combine that with the rumored streetscape re-do of this area of Prospect and we have a winner. I know there are multiple empty storefronts lining the complex but since Prospect was only mentioned in KJP's story (for now at least) I wasn't to sure about the chances of those getting filled. 

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4 minutes ago, MyPhoneDead said:

One thing I will give the people behind this project is they are VERY ambitious. This type of project is definitely as risk and creating it in such a large space as Tower City to start is very gutsy but commendable. If you are going to do an ambitious project like this though you go hard or go home and they are definitely going hard. One thing I wish Cleveland did more often was I wish they "went for it all" with more of their projects, I wish their projects were things that got people outside of this board talking but they end up more conservative (The PHS Chandelier). The moniker of "world's largest __________" definitely is a headline grabber and will definitely catch peoples attention and draw interest. Combined with the type of space this project offers and its location as well as transit access it should be a home run. 

Cleveland was built on ingenuity.  Actually, due to economic forces and forces beyond our control, we've had to take a more conservative approach in development compared to other cities.  I would rather the measured and conservative approach than have empty towers such as in cities like Miami, Atlanta, Dallas,Phoenix, etc.

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26 minutes ago, MyPhoneDead said:

So first, great to hear there will be SOME retail presence at Tower city. I believe making Prospect avenue the target was a brilliant idea, those storefronts have always been underutilized (I've never seen them occupied, if they have idk by who) as well as the street itself. 

 

Second, in the story you said upstairs (Public Square level) would maintain retail inside of Tower City, but you named stores that are downstairs, would they possibly shift them? Also (I know it's speculation) but do you think T-Mobile stays as it's a technology company that recently remodeled their space. 

 

 

I was only speculating as to what retailers would located between the rapid station and Public Square portico to capitalize off the pedestrian traffic. I suspect that a couple of other retailers will remain at Tower City but where they will locate and what they will be,  I have no idea.


"Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities."-Voltaire

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5 minutes ago, MyPhoneDead said:

I don't I only remember Tower City interior as the retail area. What stores were in the storefronts of the second picture? I agree about the connection and that is why I love the choice to move stores to Prospect, it definitely bridges a gap from the WHD and East 4th Street. Combine that with the rumored streetscape re-do of this area of Prospect and we have a winner. I know there are multiple empty storefronts lining the complex but since Prospect was only mentioned in KJP's story (for now at least) I wasn't to sure about the chances of those getting filled. 

If you dont mind me asking, how old are you?  When TC was remodeled, there were stores that internal and external entries.  You could enter Joan and David on Prospect or Internally.  You could enter Higbee's from a number of points.  You could enter Barney's or Banana Republic from external locations.  

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1 minute ago, MyTwoSense said:

If you dont mind me asking, how old are you?  When TC was remodeled, there were stores that internal and external entries.  You could enter Joan and David on Prospect or Internally.  You could enter Higbee's from a number of points.  You could enter Barney's or Banana Republic from external locations.  

26, my memories of Tower City start post 2001 so after Dillards, I didn't know it was even called the Avenue until I worked there in 2011.

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1 minute ago, MyPhoneDead said:

26, my memories of Tower City start post 2001 so after Dillards, I didn't know it was even called the Avenue until I worked there in 2011.

You're like my older Nephew and Niece.  They don't remember Tower City pre 2000.  They only remember Higbee's being 5 floors and whenever they see "A Christmas story" they are amazed at what a vibrant store Higbee's once was.

 

They  remember Warner Bros Studio Store, Gymboree, the GAP and a few other stores.

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9 hours ago, MyTwoSense said:

You're like my older Nephew and Niece.  They don't remember Tower City pre 2000.  They only remember Higbee's being 5 floors and whenever they see "A Christmas story" they are amazed at what a vibrant store Higbee's once was.

 

They  remember Warner Bros Studio Store, Gymboree, the GAP and a few other stores.

That's EXACTLY what I remember 😂 I think that era of Tower City could do pretty decent in today's downtown climate. 

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12 hours ago, MyPhoneDead said:

That's EXACTLY what I remember 😂 I think that era of Tower City could do pretty decent in today's downtown climate. 

 

Yeah, you missed how extravagant the opening was, lol.  Unfortunately, Cleveland's market wasn't conducive to some of the store's that lined it's floors at that time IMO.  When you add in cultural changes, closed in malls aren't what most American's focus on today.

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Myphonedead - If I recall correctly, the second picture had two stores.   On the left was the street entrance to Joan & David shoes (which was also accessible in the mall).   On the right was County Road, which was kind of like a Australian Banana Republic, but was only accessible from the street.  Joan & David went into bankruptcy in 2000, and Country Road exited the American market about the same time.

 

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So...sorry to sound like an armchair developer, but I wonder why this couldn't be done at the Post Office Plaza.  That building is about the same size and the Tower City public space doesn't have to be hacked apart for it.  Aside from K&D owning it instead of Bedrock--um, I think I answered my own question.

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Good question. Post office plaza is 477,000 square feet and half vacant. The Avenue is 366,000 square feet and half vacant. 


"Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities."-Voltaire

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They want a dynamic, exciting space. And from @KJP‘s scoop, Station F being their inspiration for a unique setting, regular, tucked away office space isn’t in the cards for this venture. 

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On 6/28/2019 at 4:51 PM, KJP said:

Tower+City-061319-2-CROP-s.jpg

 

FRIDAY, JUNE 28, 2019

City Block at Tower City, announcement Monday; sneak peak

 

On Monday, July 1, BlockLand Cleveland will announce that The Avenue at Tower City Center is the group's chosen site for its technology hub called City Block. The hub, as proposed, would be the world's largest technology incubator under one roof.

 

Bernie Moreno, founder and leader of BlockLand Cleveland, a volunteer effort, confirmed last week in a personal message via Twitter that the project would be announced at 4 p.m. Monday at the group's next regular meeting. The meeting will be held on the second floor of the former Plain Dealer building, 1801 Superior Ave.

 

MORE:

https://neo-trans.blogspot.com/2019/06/city-block-at-tower-city-announcement.html

 

Anyone know when this announcement will be?

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You can lead a horse to water....

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"Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities."-Voltaire

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https://www.clevescene.com/scene-and-heard/archives/2019/07/01/city-block-blockland-tech-hub-will-open-in-tower-city-in-agreement-with-bedrock-detroit

 

'City Block,' Blockland Tech Hub, Will Open in Tower City in Agreement with Bedrock Detroit

Posted By Sam Allard on Mon, Jul 1, 2019 at 2:22 pm

 

Local car dealer turned tech entrepreneur Bernie Moreno has announced that "City Block," the Blockland tech hub conceived to attract and grow start-up companies in Cleveland, will open at Tower City as early as next year. 

The development project will be a joint effort between Blockland and Bedrock Detroit, the Dan Gilbert real estate company that owns and operates The Avenue Shops at Tower City. 

Bedrock Chairman Jim Ketai released a statement saying that his company, which has studied multiple ways to adapt the depleted Tower City mall since it acquired the property in 2016, has "entered into negotiations" with the Blockland community. 
 

 

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Edited by dave2017
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On 3/3/2019 at 10:29 PM, marty15 said:

Google is behind the new Tower City makeover. And look for that section of Prospect Ave. to be turned to pedestrian only. 

Now we wait for the meat 🍖 

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https://www.cleveland.com/news/2019/07/whats-next-for-tower-city-mall-city-block-proposed-tech-hub-confirmed.html

 

It’s a $110 million commitment and not all the money is raised yet, so Blockland volunteers will need to secure sponsors, equity partners, tenants and — hopefully — a large tech company to anchor the space, founder Bernie Moreno said in a phone interview.

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6 minutes ago, marty15 said:

Now we wait for the meat 🍖 

If Google is really behind it why does Moreno seem to indicate otherwise?

 

It’s a $110 million commitment and not all the money is raised yet, so Blockland volunteers will need to secure sponsors, equity partners, tenants and — hopefully — a large tech company to anchor the space, founder Bernie Moreno said in a phone interview. 

 

Though the deal is set, the specifics are not. The renovation will be done in phases, but those are not yet defined. There have been conversations with many potential tenants, Moreno says, but none are locked up yet. His own blockchain company, Ownum, will be one of the first to move in.

 

Edit: RMB beat me too it. 

Edited by cle_guy90

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My source has been proven correct on everything else revealed thus far, 4 months ago mind you. Patience. 

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1 minute ago, marty15 said:

My source has been proven correct on everything else revealed thus far, 4 months ago mind you. Patience. 

 

I believe in Marty's source 😍

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2 hours ago, PaxtonMarley said:

I know that Prospect has always been Tower City's back alley, but between that and shutting down Superior to E-W traffic, it's gonna be ugly. 

 

They can always build phase II of the casino and put another road paralleling Huron... after all, Sherwin Williams is moving imminently, right @KJP? 😬

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4 hours ago, marty15 said:

My source has been proven correct on everything else revealed thus far, 4 months ago mind you. Patience. 

 

 

Not saying you you aren’t correct, but I’ve been close to this project for 8 months now, and have yet to hear “google” in any capacity. 

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