Cincinnati: CUF / Corryville: Development and News

[wholtone 0]

I heard the developers said if Christy's stays then no deal. I wonder why they don't build it at the Stop-and-Go or Pomodori's instead? There isn't crap to look at at those corners.

[el double u 0]

What people and businesses?  There were at least a dozen, if not two dozen businesses torn down for this development. 

 

Adding 2,000~ residents for 9 months out of the year does not significantly change the amount of commercial activity an area that already was seeing 30,000~ students and 10,000 staff visit daily. 

 

People as in 65 West is 100% leased and USquare is over 50% leased 6 months before it opens.

 

Businesses as in UPA having one open space and USquare being something like 90% leased.

 

These apartments aren't like the dorms.  People don't pack up and leave for every long weekend or break.  I lived in 65 West this past summer and there were people everywhere.

 

I'm not sure that 10,000 staff ever visited daily, but UC's offices and the eventual hotel should bring plenty of people to the area as well as all of the residents living above.

[ryanlammi 388]

Christy's/Lenhardt's owner ready to sell

 

This deal is moving very fast...

[taestell 798]

I have always though the Clifton Natural Foods building was unique with its rounded corner.

 

Developers will always put forward the plan that maximizes their profit and minimizes their effort. If Lenhardt's and/or the Clifton Natural Foods building get designated as historic and can't be demolished, this developer (or another) will eventually come back and propose a smaller, L-shaped building that wraps around Clifton Natural Foods... or one where Stop & Go is located... or one where Pomodori's and their parking lot is located... etc. We're not losing anything by rejecting this mediocre proposal.

 

I wonder about the longer term impact on the area being demolished for just student housing. The U.S. had an unusually high birth rate from around 1988-1992, which explains why there are so many college-aged students right now and UC is at peak student population. The birth rate has been dropping since then (currently at its lowest-ever rate), meaning that overall student enrollment is likely to drop at colleges across the country. So unless UC is going to attract enough students away from competing schools to maintain an enrollment of 40,000, we probably won't even need this much student housing 10 years from now. And since incoming students will probably opt to live in these "nice" new complexes, all of these houses in Clifton Heights will either sit vacant or be rented to non-students.

[taestell 798]

>whatever it's called now

 

First it was McMillan Manor.

Then it was Sterling McMillan

Now it's "Campus Park"

http://www.campusparkcincy.com/

 

They have gutted the lobby and filled its windows with posters showing even douchier-looking happy students. 

 

Why do they keep changing the name? Has the management changed twice? Or are they just trying to outrun the negative word-of-mouth and Yelp reviews? I only heard negative reviews of the place from people I knew who lived there.

[willalbro 0]

And since incoming students will probably opt to live in these "nice" new complexes, all of these houses in Clifton Heights will either sit vacant or be rented to non-students.

 

And this is exactly what will likely happen. Even over the years, CUF has seen students shift to living closer to campus. Many landlords shifted to Section 8 in the past when this happened.

 

There are too many slum lords around here to compete with new apartments close to campus, where students are less likely to be robbed.

[el double u 0]

And since incoming students will probably opt to live in these "nice" new complexes, all of these houses in Clifton Heights will either sit vacant or be rented to non-students.

 

And this is exactly what will likely happen. Even over the years, CUF has seen students shift to living closer to campus. Many landlords shifted to Section 8 in the past when this happened.

 

There are too many slum lords around here to compete with new apartments close to campus, where students are less likely to be robbed.

 

I think there will always be a market for the rental houses in CUF simply because not all UC students can afford the $600+ per month to live in these new developments.  If students can't afford one of these new apartments there's really nowhere else for them to go except to the houses or possibly an older apartment building.

[willalbro 0]

I think there will always be a market for the rental houses in CUF simply because not all UC students can afford the $600+ per month to live in these new developments.  If students can't afford one of these new apartments there's really nowhere else for them to go except to the houses or possibly an older apartment building.

 

Oh, there certainly will always be a market for student housing, and the landlords who offer reasonably priced, newly upgraded housing will get the business. My point is there will be less students in the area as they add all this new housing closer to campus. Large developers are taking advantage of a lack of new housing in the area. I don't like the newer developments, because many of them are cheaply built and unsightly, but they correctly target the market.

 

As for price, I can tell you from being a home-owner in CUF, and knowing many of the landlords in CUF, that many of them have the attitude towards all the new developments in the area that "We let them determine what we can charge students for our buildings." So if the new apartments are priced at $600.00, then landlords in the area will price theirs at $575.00. (bogus prices used to illustrate a point)

 

Arrogant? Maybe. Short sighted? Perhaps. The way it is? Definitely.

 

I'm not talking every landlord. Just several of the major players I know. There will always be slum lords who rent party houses to students who do not want new apartments, with all their rules an such.

 

My 2 cents anyway.

[jmecklenborg 580]

>with all their rules an such.

 

At OU they built one of those places and here is what happened:

[willalbro 0]

At OU they built one of those places and here is what happened:

 

ROFL! I would love to see that happen up on McMillan. They used to have Cinco De Stratford around here. That is until a riot broke out.

[el double u 0]

ROFL! I would love to see that happen up on McMillan. They used to have Cinco De Stratford around here. That is until a riot broke out.

 

March 9th, 2013 will be "Clifton Fest" on Stratford.  Check it out on facebook.

[willalbro 0]

ROFL! I would love to see that happen up on McMillan. They used to have Cinco De Stratford around here. That is until a riot broke out.

 

March 9th, 2013 will be "Clifton Fest" on Stratford.  Check it out on facebook.

 

Thanks for the link!

[GCrites80s 451]

[quote author=willalbro link=topic=28327.msg662734#msg662734

 

I'm not talking every landlord. Just several of the major players I know. There will always be slum lords who rent party houses to students who do not want new apartments, with all their rules an such.

 

 

When I first got out of high school I rented an apartment on my own in a complex full of full-blown adults and attended a branch campus. When it was time go away to school, there was no way in hell that I was going to deal with all those bullshit summer camp rules. Not from the university and especially not from the private sector. I'm no rebel or "loud at night" kinda guy, but so many of the rules revolved around petty little offenses that someone old enough to go to war shouldn't have to worry about. I selected Shawnee State because their housing arrangements treated people like adults. What kind of people are those super controlled environments good for? TV addicts? Gamers? I don't think they're good for anybody -- especially not these people you see who are like 29 and living in them. And they wonder why people have trouble joining the adult population.

[natininja 1]

They used to have Cinco De Stratford around here. That is until a riot broke out.

 

Oh man, the tear gas.... :D

[jmecklenborg 580]

>And they wonder why people have trouble joining the adult population.

 

 

When I went to OU I lived at University Court Apartments, or something like that.  There was also a University Plaza Apartments, or something like that.  They looked pretty much alike but were a mile away from one another.  One morning I woke up in some random person's apartment in the opposite complex.  Also there was undeniable evidence that I took my pants off immediately upon entering this mystery aparment. 

[el double u 0]

>And they wonder why people have trouble joining the adult population.

 

 

When I went to OU I lived at University Court Apartments, or something like that.  There was also a University Plaza Apartments, or something like that.  They looked pretty much alike but were a mile away from one another.  One morning I woke up in some random person's apartment in the opposite complex.  Also there was undeniable evidence that I took my pants off immediately upon entering this mystery aparment.

 

LMAO

[GCrites80s 451]

>And they wonder why people have trouble joining the adult population.

 

 

When I went to OU I lived at University Court Apartments, or something like that.  There was also a University Plaza Apartments, or something like that.  They looked pretty much alike but were a mile away from one another.  One morning I woke up in some random person's apartment in the opposite complex.  Also there was undeniable evidence that I took my pants off immediately upon entering this mystery aparment. 

 

Ahh, that old did-I-get-laid-last-night? feeling.

[willalbro 0]

there was no way in hell that I was going to deal with all those bullsh!t summer camp rules. Not from the university and especially not from the private sector.

 

I wouldn't either. I like having my own house where I am free to do what the hell I want, even if it is hang around outside, barbecue and howl at the moon till the wee hours. Don't need a chaperone.

[jmecklenborg 580]

>feeling.

 

No I didn't mean to insinuate that at all.  I got lost leaving a party, blacked out, and apparently walked around until I found an open door.  You can only get away with that kind of stuff in college towns, because everywhere else you're going to get shot.  Kind of like how you can only get away with climbing through people's windows at 4am to steal their beer and maybe a quart of milk in college towns. 

[el double u 0]

Kind of like how you can only get away with climbing through people's windows at 4am to steal their beer and maybe a quart of milk in college towns. 

 

What college did YOU go to lol

[jmicha 31]

This isn't the right place to put this, but as far as I know there isn't a Corryville thread.

 

Santa Ono has stated on Facebook that Taste of Belgium is opening a place on Short Vine. This is super awesome news! I love Taste of Belgium and will definitely be going there once it opens.

[natininja 1]

^ Very good news! Great spot for a ToB.

[jmicha 31]

I wholeheartedly agree! If I had to guess I'd say that come five years from now Short Vine is going to be exploding with activity. Taste of Belgium is going to be a nice draw for Corryville and will hopefully encourage others to follow suit.

[ryanlammi 388]

Just so everyone is aware, I have merged the Schiel School redevelopment page with a couple of posts that were in the wrong thread (CUF thread talking about Taste of Belgium). The Schiel School topic was pretty far off topic anyway talking about other projects in the Corryville/Short Vine area so I decided to just rename it and merge it with a couple of posts for easier digestion. Let me know if you have any concerns.

[neilworms 21]

After seeing pictures - the Schiel development is pretty terrible IMO - it tries to incorporate historic features and fails miserably by sticking Vinyl siding in all the wrong places and just generally having an awkward shape.  I would have been happier with a street facing brick facade and a back vinyl or cement block facade.  More garbage replacing great old buildings :(

 

 

[jmecklenborg 580]

The thing on Short Vine is probably better than U Square. 

[neilworms 21]

Not only that but even more sh!t is in the works: http://www.building-cincinnati.com/2013/08/council-approves-plan-for-160-unit.html

 

[Edit: Knee Jerk reaction due to looking at the wrong block, the housing there is nothing special for the most part]

 

There are some lovely old victorians there!  So f-ing typical.  Yet the CPA doesn't have like some kind of watch list?  They are f-ing useless :(

[jjakucyk 152]

^ What old victorians?  There's two sort-of-ok row houses on Euclid, and a mish-mash of early 20th century bungalows and 1 1/2 story row houses on Charlton.  There's some nicer houses on the OTHER side of Euclid, but that's not part of this project.  It looks like they're tucking the larger building inside the block and surrounding it with some lower-profile townhouses, which isn't so bad.  This block is woefully underbuilt for its location as it is.

 

I do find it sad that these projects all come with a large parking garage.  Maybe if they did actual townhouses with their own independent garages they wouldn't need to build a whole separate parking structure which then requires the rest of the project to be scaled up to yield a reasonable return on investment. 

[neilworms 21]

My bad, I was looking at the wrong block.  There is literally only one townhouse that's worthwhile there, its not much.  Still I hope they are going to up their quality of infill.  I kind of knee-jerked, mainly because its amazing how these projects keep getting pushed through and people don't usually know of them unless they are on the Comm Council until its too late to do anything about them.

 

It would be nice if the Corryville Comm Council did maintain and even pay for their website which is cybersquatted btw.

 

The thing on Short Vine is probably better than U Square.

 

Agreed, its a step in the right direction.

[CincyGuy45202 0]

The thing on Short Vine is probably better than U Square.

 

Ya. It's actually not that bad. Could have been better absolutely but not horrendous.

[ryanlammi 388]

Here are some updated photos I took on my phone this week of the "Views on Vine" development at the old Schiel School. Definitely the best new development that Uptown Rentals has ever done. That doesn't mean it's awesome or even what I would want in that space, but definitely a step up.

 

It appears they still have a lot of storefronts to rent out and that people have already moved in to the apartments above. I think this will be a great thing for Corryville's nightlife and vitality.

 

 

 

 

[OCtoCincy 0]

Right down the street at Rochelle and Eden the first two buildings of the 18 condo unit development as the next phase of Stetson square is under construction.

 

[neilworms 21]

^-That's a lot better than the giant pit that was there the last few years... :P

[neilworms 21]

Saw this article in Soapbox, but its pretty slim on details as to what's getting demoed and what (if anything) is being kept.... :P

 

http://soapboxmedia.com/devnews/082013shortvinedevelopments.aspx

 

 

Does anyone know more details?

[jmecklenborg 580]

Unfortunately I'm sensing that they know they can't get every single storefront rented, especially when the new apartments have had ground level retail built.  There was the plan 3 years ago to tear down everything on the Martino's side.  I really hope that that plan is dead, or that at the least they would preserve the facades. 

[CincyGuy45202 0]

Here's the one thing that may have saved that entire side of the street.

 

In 2009 the Martino's owners (Anguilli family) plan was to demolish everything on the east side of the street (across from Bogarts).  They didn't get funding. Plan died.

 

In 2011, the Anguilli family bought the HIDEOUS crap development just north of Charlton on the east side of the road (for $1.5 million!)

 

Now, if they want to build a big massive new development, they may be more likely to take that down as it has a much larger footprint for a larger garage and more apartments and is hideous and in need of massive repairs to that garage.

 

Here's to hoping that hideous 80's thing comes down and the historic part of the block stays.

[jmecklenborg 580]

^Hmmm....the two buildings on the same side of that block just south of the Niehoff Studio are up for sale, listed at $500,000.  That is way to high in my opinion, so they are clearly hoping that someone eyeing what us Short Vine old timers will always remember as being the 24-hour Kinko's building are attempting to assemble that block, with the exception of Niehoff obviously. 

 

However I don't see why someone couldn't just keep the existing garage and build a mid-rise apartment on the site of the Kinko's and its majestic ATM plaza.  The development next to Staggerlies on the old backpack store property is about 195x55.  The Kinko's has almost exactly the same 190-200 feet of frontage on Vine and is about 180 feet deep on its north side.  So they could put something bigger in there without having to build a parking garage.   

 

The big prize though is the Post Office property.  It is has a footprint about identical in size to the big thing that just went up on the Shiel School site. 

 

 

[helmespc 0]

The Angiulli's have some renderings of their vision of Short Vine (at least from charlton to corry) on the walls of Martino's... mostly looks like renovated buildings with decent streetscaping. Nothing as drastic as downing the whole block....

 

I'd love to see the old plaza and crummy parking garage go poof... it really kills the flow of that side of the street. The old La Rosa's on the other side needs to go too.... or at least get a makeover.

[CincyGuy45202 0]

No developer would ever consider keeping that garage.  It doesn't meet most codes, it's not up to standards of any kind.  If they demolish the buildings (which they totally should) that thing is going away.

[natininja 1]

Short Vine could seriously use rail transit.